mircea_popescu: i guess some work poured into a semblance of unified dissemination interface is unavoidable, hence the shinohai wp project.
mircea_popescu: sort-of what's been happening with the wot, for instance, anyway.
mircea_popescu: i'm thinking the way this will end up is to separate the data processing ; data acquisition ; and data dissemination. evidently people good at any of these aren't good at the others, and have incredibly elaborate excuses for maintaining the situation that likely aren't worth cutting through.
jurov: mircea_popescu: see later in the log, apparently appended csv would enable corruption O.o
asciilifeform: and more of these, later, in l0gz.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-18#1504886 << Known Shared Factors: 1, Self (Ok, for now!). so it's just the same key seen from multiple internet-facing machines.
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-18#1504809 << just fyi the new 1.82M ssh key diff won't have that keyword in there, as i've shortened the comment string, as per various grumblings re this.
a111: Logged on 2016-06-20 20:38 mircea_popescu: recall, jurov parsed all of github, produced a pile of keys and the convertor code
Framedragger: (hm, i'll go thru the ip clustering discussion again tomorrow or thereabouts, interesting stuff and interesting speculation how this came to be. need to find time to do some actual anal-sis and graphing....)
Framedragger: asciilifeform: just curious, is all that beefy server memory actually being used? by either djb gcd or db?
Framedragger: effective_cache_size e.g. could be set to 75% of total system memory. otherwise - don't want to presume - but it may end up paging the fuck out out of the disk. or other things..
asciilifeform: (other than rss)
asciilifeform: i'll admit that i've wondered for a while, what the ft meade version of phuctor looks like.
trinque: I was sharing the lulz; db makes sense
asciilifeform: afaik reiser is the champ.
asciilifeform: of cpu also, but the box is well-equipped in that respect
asciilifeform: 'moral' of this thread is - phuctor stretches the limits of disk, fs, db, various shoddy duct tape that makes up modern kompyooooting shitsoup
Framedragger: i meant that i supplied them to you as one key in one file. but yeah kk
asciilifeform: in old ver of phuctor they lived on fs;
asciilifeform: they live in db.
asciilifeform: they are not.
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-18#1505027 << well the rfc4880-formatted keys are already in one-file-per-key, in truth
asciilifeform: this is the v state thread all over again.
asciilifeform: nor am i interested in waiting for months for the conversion.
trinque: but if that'll be nightly, I expect there'll be big farts of RSS at phuctor-o'clock
trinque: I don't mind either way
asciilifeform: jurov: understand, there has to be a db, because ALL mods get bernsteined against ALL mods AND the 8ball.
jurov: if alf did csv, he could just keep appending to the static file
asciilifeform: namely, all of the .html will be generated nightly.
jurov: *the speed keeps
jurov: you actually tried lynx? as we are speaking, it claims to read 30MB, at 340KiB/sec, and the keeps getting down
asciilifeform: trinque: the only one i know of that runs continuously without blackhole or other hiccup.
asciilifeform: box also hosts the only (afaik) 'five nines'-reliable trb node.
asciilifeform: the remainder-tree (see bernstein's paper)
Framedragger: ..cause you need to keep the eight-ball in memory, right?
Framedragger: does the box have ssd?
asciilifeform: and there is really no cure for this.
Framedragger: asciilifeform: well you wouldnt be you if it were otherwise i suppose!
asciilifeform: and they aren't consolidatable.
Framedragger: and e,N,IP for the additional 1.82M key ball is in the http://95.85.10.71:8000/all/openpgp/ssh_openpgp_diff_2016-07-13.tar (file at top, directories under contain the openpgp'd versions). hope this makes sense, it's a bit ad hoc
Framedragger: (i mean i'd mirror the thing, or something)
Framedragger: asciilifeform: i implied that i'd be interested to maybe write an api; if everything's in postgres properly indexed, should be fine. hey i'm a masochist, all the better for tmsr!!1
a111: Logged on 2016-07-18 17:38 asciilifeform: Framedragger: do you still have the raw mods somewhere ?
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-18#1504950 << you mean mods in the e,N,IP format? yes and they should be on the web, one sec
asciilifeform: Framedragger: not only would an api take up more complexity than phuctor at present in its entirety, but the thing barely keeps up as it is.
asciilifeform: you do not need any of the phuctor logic for this
asciilifeform: (a mod with 2 or more ips gets a colour; plot each ip on the traditional 2d grid, and connect with line of that colour.)
asciilifeform: it would not take long to snarf them up and 2d plot by ip
asciilifeform: Framedragger: do you still have the raw mods somewhere ?
Framedragger: asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: hey i may be up for setting up some kind of searchable thing with everything dumped into postgres. not sure how much worth vs. time, but could be useful as these stats grow
a111: Logged on 2016-07-18 16:07 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it will be an interesting anal piercing moment for the tor aficionados - EVERYBODY gets to 'upgrade'
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-18#1504774 << ftr, there's a consensus mechanism, so it's not "everything works or everything's broken"
asciilifeform: there are not TWO
asciilifeform: jurov: because there is one proggy.
jurov: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/sadmods causes firefox-47 to spin for several minutes and then render garbage
asciilifeform: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/bba8b759-dc4b-4df6-9085-e49bc2804527 << aaand another.
trinque: there it went
asciilifeform: ALL OVER the net.
trinque: huh, wotpaste wont resolve over here; I shit thee not
asciilifeform: speaking of all of this, did anybody ever crawl the tor exit pubkeys ?
mircea_popescu: then people can search in that.
asciilifeform: having ANY new fields would make the thing 100x more complex.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the one important thing you should add is "search by ip"
asciilifeform: it is a valid point: there is no physical way to distinguish 'all connected to same box' from 'boxes with dupe key'
mircea_popescu: this afaik didn't exist on the open nets afore.
mircea_popescu: alternatively, nobody could foresee the terrorists will use ssh keys as rsa unifying underlying, so they're entirely unprepared for any of this
asciilifeform: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/5C4F4981D4A37A5C961765FAB5CF1F30774125DEF35E37AA648EC5B015A4F094 << have another.
asciilifeform: i should like to hear the 'innocent', boeckian explanation for the tall piles of dupolade.
asciilifeform: it is painful but: i kept the proggy short, and it is - afaik - bug-free.
mircea_popescu: this "middle of the road" thing is bad for both usecases : when you grep it you waste bw on html crud ; meanwhile browsing luser is stuck.
asciilifeform: my current hypothesis is that enemy was a little more clever than reported by the bocks, and divided dupe keys into equivalence classes
asciilifeform: thing hasn't even eaten first parcel of the sshkeyz
mircea_popescu: i'm guessing phuctor is right on schedule : just about time for yet another paper, a month after the prev a month after the prev etc.
asciilifeform: 'their boxes'
mircea_popescu: wtf is this anyway, people decide to use a single key on all their boxes ?
mircea_popescu: i would say as a matter of policy we should immediately hijack, copy and completely wipe these boxes.
asciilifeform: almost as interesting is the number of boxes with DUPLICATE keys
mircea_popescu: so we have THREE pairs, all on the same /18, and with different large factors.
mircea_popescu: o wait it's the same factor actually innit.
mircea_popescu: if it's factory baked, how come the collisions only happen in C blocks ?
mircea_popescu: but it's not the same key.
asciilifeform: these turn up regularly.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: pretty clear to the naked eye. dsl modem.
mircea_popescu: you can be on the same list and don't even have to spend 1500 dubaloos.
asciilifeform: we had this thread: unmasking is only effective when there IS somebody interesting to unmask. at other times, you gotta emplace that cocaine into the toilet tank.
mircea_popescu: so is anyone going to actually bother a) factoring the ssh keys found weak ; b) go own the machines, copy over their ssh agent ; c) hack it apart see wtf caused the collisions ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'unmask', turns out, isn't nearly 'user-friendly' enough for nsa, they would also like arbitrary ram r/w into the chumpers
mircea_popescu: good thing you can't use timings and other side channels to unmaks them when such a thing happens.
asciilifeform: this includes the exit operators.
asciilifeform: (the directory server is hardcoded in, iirc)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it will be an interesting anal piercing moment for the tor aficionados - EVERYBODY gets to 'upgrade'
mats: on the subject, anyone for some ad hoc btcusd options?
asciilifeform has long wondered: whether tmsr will have a new bitbet
mircea_popescu: "Tonga will be permanently shut down and all associated crytographic keys destroyed on 2016-08-31. This should give the Tor developers ample time to stand up a substitute. I will terminate the chron job we set up so many years ago at that time that copies over the descriptors." << if there were a bitbet i'd put a little on "there will not be a replacement in time"
mircea_popescu: o check it out, tor finally going to meet ripple in that happy space over the horizon ?
asciilifeform: easier, really, than the machining.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: folks cast aluminum in jungle conditions all the time, it is not so hard.
jurov: oh it can't machine the thread?
asciilifeform: jurov: the thing starts life as a casting, yes, though.
asciilifeform: jurov: can't cast the thread
asciilifeform: not unless there were no proper ones to be had.
asciilifeform: the traditional item is made of ordinary aluminum.
asciilifeform: folks have made them from wood, etc.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: ar(m16) 'receiver' is not a pressurized part, it just holds the mag and the trigger clockwork
asciilifeform: you still have to order the 'eightypercent' from some vendor
a111: Logged on 2016-07-18 15:40 mircea_popescu: not sure worth the 1500, but anyway.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-18#1504707 << think for a minute. 1500 (about ~triple the cost of making the mill yourself from surplus partz) AND NOW BE ON THE LIST
a111: Logged on 2016-07-17 19:58 asciilifeform: 'Mr Vancel said the men were shooting at each other before the officers arrived. "This was not a 'come at police' situation they weren't targeting the police at first - I don't assume so - because these were men out here shooting at each other in an empty parking lot until the police showed up and it turned into a gun battle," he added.' << lel
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-17#1504301 << just the fact that "they were not attacking police deliberately" is now part of the list of factoids aparartchick has to insert into articles is indicative of just how fucking petrified teh usg is.
asciilifeform: (notice, ~all of the tricky metalwork: threading, horizontal drilling - is done)
mircea_popescu: or whatever you call the multi-folio piles of maculature that place produces.
mircea_popescu: he tells himself this is a stepping stone to a carrier as congress gofer - where he'll suck his boss' cock and do the same thing to "laws"
mircea_popescu: by now an idiot familiar to soviet journos is well at work in the "mainstream" media. his job ? stick talking points into unrelated items.
mircea_popescu: bloomberg piece includes the official ideological discussion of trump, check that out.
asciilifeform: but this could change at the drop of a hat
asciilifeform: just like the barrels, clockwork, bolts, etc
asciilifeform: they are - currently - openly sold in usa
asciilifeform: and, interestingly, won't even make the 'receiver' from aluminum billet, you need a '80% complete' one
mircea_popescu: not sure worth the 1500, but anyway.
asciilifeform: it so happens that i was reading the docs for his mill machine just now, https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0206/7642/files/GG2_Manual.pdf?4483922796295118618
a111: Logged on 2016-07-17 17:57 asciilifeform: in other 'news', this schmuck is still in business, apparently : http://www.bloomberg.com/features/2016-cody-wilson-ghost-gunner-ar-15
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-17#1504265 << i suspect by now the "3d printed gun" is moreover useful ; afaik work is underway to the typically ustarded pivot of "we're not forbidding weapons - only working ones ; you can still have 3d printed plastic shit! it'll be just as good as the real thing for what you do with it anyway, which is to say jack off".
asciilifeform: it is almost as if they all heard napoleon's 'in every private's rucksack there is a feldmarshal's baton'
a111: Logged on 2016-07-17 17:31 asciilifeform: the ~STABILITY~ implied in an alt-world where software ~actually works correctly~ is Ur-terrifying to the typical maggot, whether of the microshit or 'open sores' variety
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-17#1504253 << this ties in somehow with the typically murican expectation of "Social mobility", but the implications are yet murky.
mircea_popescu: no media item in the history of items was ever profitable in the aluminum siding sense of profitability.
mircea_popescu: but for the shareholders ?
mircea_popescu: what's the russian expression, карниз ? :D
reydev: i doubt most of these social media sites will ever be profitable? except indeed for the ones issuing the shares
mircea_popescu: think : who's raping who here ? the game is not "does usg rape us or doesn't it". it's "have raped it yet ?" not binary but unary, only one final state available.
asciilifeform: (and why would, e.g., crapple, buy it? other than to kill)
asciilifeform: who, i wonder, would continue to write for qntra after this hypothetical crapocalypse ?
mircea_popescu: that's the revenue model of EVERYTHING else, why'd you go "i don't see the qntra revenue model" ? do you go around saying "i don't see the linkedin revenue model" ?
mircea_popescu: if qntra sells to... i dunno, who hasn't bought anything in a while, apple say ? for a perfectly market-reasonable hundred billion dollars, then a shareholder that bought however many shares for however many bitcents will receive however many hundreds of millions of dollars.
reydev: anyhow, i dont see the revenue model for qntra if there is any, is there something to read about it?
reydev: im just not at the computer
mircea_popescu: reydev anyway, nothing keeping you from joining... the web of trust. you'll likely be able to self voice, at least unless/until you go militantly stupid.
mircea_popescu: seems rather profitable.
reydev: while i'm up, can i ask wrt qntra, is it meant to be non-profit? as in, is the idea that shareholders are like sponsors?
mircea_popescu: anyway, archived as https://archive.is/SiBb5 and https://archive.is/8ffqQ just in case someone wants the names for whatever kill list later on
mircea_popescu: not even "bunch of illiterate kids reinventing the world without bothering to check up the dictionary first", but the usual case of "imbeciles still jacking off to the notion VC can stand up to MP".
mircea_popescu: the only impact they'll have on anything is if i decide to use their skulls to remodel a wall. then they'll impact alright, and even temporarily color things.
mircea_popescu: imagine, some fucktards are going to have "the greaters impact" on "self-sovereign identity"
mircea_popescu: for any value of fine that reduces to "flail meaninglessly among themselves"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform for as long as they have the sense to stay out of the reach of the fortress that sunk teh ether-dao, they'll be fine.
asciilifeform: 'The Web of Trust is a buzzword for a new model of decentralized self-sovereign identity. It’s a phrase that dates back almost twenty-five years, the classic definition derives from PGP. But some use it as a term to include self-sovereign identity authentication & verification, certificate validation, and reputation assessment, while the vibrant blockchain community is also drawing new attention to the concept we aim to reboot it.'
mircea_popescu: can you imagine all the dudebro biscuit eating going around in poorly lit, unventilated basements while chanting my name and pretending the bit of plastic up their butt is really my penis ?
a111: Logged on 2016-07-18 14:30 shinohai: I DM'd Stephan Tual on twitter to ask why he blocked me. Reply was that "you write fabricated information on The Dao and I believe you to be in league with mircea_popescu".
asciilifeform: and, more generally speaking, AGGRESSIVE debabelization - BURN the 10,001 video boards, we need ONE; BURN the 10,001 allocators - we need ONE, in silicon; etc
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-18#1504597 << a) beautiful to see phuctor work as gcd proper, innit ? and b) wtf is with these broken ssh keys, they're all used on narrow ip spaces. third case today it's xx.xx.xx.yy vs xx.xx.xx.zz sort of thing ?
a111: Logged on 2016-07-18 13:23 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-18#1504568 << the impalement is inescapable. i simply object to the notion of sparing the hardware they built - it is every bit as insidiously and infectiously idiotic as all of their software creations.
thestringpuller: i think only LTC has some liquidity on the bid side...
mircea_popescu: (i only bother with the reference because it's a very convenient example of many thousands extant that "nobody knows about".)
thestringpuller: Slock.it adding more problems to the p2p market. I asked someone once, "What keeps people from just stealing your bike once the slock is unlocked?" "Uh I dunno. We never got that far."
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller http://trilema.com/the-life-and-times-of-one-phil-daian-aspiring-nigger-apprentice-cocksucker might have something to do with it.
mircea_popescu: i can't quote the item for lacking a title ; romanian copies are curated and collected by ioan ursu as "historia turchesca 1300-1514), editura academiei romane, 1910 - where it's found at page 91 and urm.
mircea_popescu: Framedragger wordplay not present ; note that this is a work of fiction - for instance the "killing of the commander of artillery" actually happened during a siege by mahomed 2. apud giovanni maria angiolello, Venetian banker to the sultan : "Era il resto di Suzava con fossi et palanche circondata, le case et chiese erano di legname coperte di scandole, solamente un castello v'era fabricato di pietra et calcina, a coste, et d
shinohai: I DM'd Stephan Tual on twitter to ask why he blocked me. Reply was that "you write fabricated information on The Dao and I believe you to be in league with mircea_popescu".
a111: Logged on 2016-06-01 17:49 asciilifeform: btw when i went down into the snakepit with several dozen renowned 'cryptographers' earlier this year, i asked a few folks about this.
asciilifeform: chronicled, i think, in the l0gz, somewhere
asciilifeform: jurov: know that, if i had not escaped from rupturefarms, i would be sent there.
shinohai: Maybe there could be a dapp for that.
jurov: "Cyber Grand Challenge: a competition that seeks to create automatic defensive systems capable of reasoning about flaws, formulating patches and deploying them on a network in real time."
a111: Logged on 2016-07-18 13:05 Framedragger: ...but yeah. the last para is a kind of foreshadowing i imagine, skeleton of a giant and all. such a strong image, incl of what's to come for them...
Framedragger: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-18#1504584 << (just realized the 'giant' refers to the fortress itself. but works just as well)
a111: Logged on 2016-07-18 11:31 mircea_popescu: i don't agree with his illuministic/humanitarian blaming of the hardware, i believe we can't have computers until and unless impaling every single derp currently involved in computing in any capacity, but this looks like a dispute for the ages.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-18#1504568 << the impalement is inescapable. i simply object to the notion of sparing the hardware they built - it is every bit as insidiously and infectiously idiotic as all of their software creations.
Framedragger: ...but yeah. the last para is a kind of foreshadowing i imagine, skeleton of a giant and all. such a strong image, incl of what's to come for them...
Framedragger: so the iablonovski fellow was the same who had advised against the siege, and who insisted on the jagers' bravery and terms of surrender afterwards
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: re "Your name is enough cannon, Highness, said Pototki." << (just curious: is the wordplay present in romanian, too?)
Framedragger: damn mircea_popescu, your wordspersec rate is good. (and i'm yet to read the siege story!)
mircea_popescu: i dunno wtf is with them.
shinohai: http://trilema.com/2016/to-the-dao-and-the-ethereum-community-fuck-you/#comment-117699 <<< bwahaha this guy actually asked you to cryptocat mircea_popescu ? LOLOL
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: i don't agree with his illuministic/humanitarian blaming of the hardware, i believe we can't have computers until and unless impaling every single derp currently involved in computing in any capacity, but this looks like a dispute for the ages.
mircea_popescu: of the current shit.
mircea_popescu: especially his discussion of kqueue and the hashtable/array duality + fd_getfile workings strictly indicates a) he's an idiot ; b) that http://trilema.com/2016/cargo-cults-a-case-study/ 's "This is what cargo cultism is, you see : memetic stupidity, inescapable for the aculturated. Even if they try. Especially if they try." is exactly right and, sadly, c) that alf is exactly correct : we can't have computers as a continuation
mircea_popescu: incidentally, weird that the capon population doesn't come up with this, you know ? there should be The Office Slut, a magazine, depicting and discussing items of juvenile interest.
mircea_popescu: sorta like it's the job of the chick playing the cleric to go under the table once the raid's done ?
mircea_popescu: and in other boobs, http://66.media.tumblr.com/13534c9f65c51506b534af2f2612b143/tumblr_nmnauuD7wf1tmg9jco1_1280.jpg
a111: Logged on 2016-07-18 02:27 hanbot: asciilifeform it's when they don't deliberately tent their fingers with evil glee (or alternatively, pet a sleeping cat from comfortable armchair) afore launching Plans to Set the Werld on Fire.
mircea_popescu: consider the practical, smaller example of blog software. you ... can;t use it ; i can.
mircea_popescu: from the other direction : while i wouldn't throw away better machines if someone offered some - nobody does.
asciilifeform: which is a fallacy because... correct-c still is not conducive to fits-in-head; is not readily distinguishable by naked eye from underhanded-c; cannot provide rational guarantees of handling error conditions mid-way; and 10,001 other defects that don't look like defects to folks who grew up with crippled systems
mircea_popescu: there's large trucks, even now, with clutch.
mircea_popescu: but altogether the argument seems to me something like "stick shift vehicle will always end in a crash".
a111: Logged on 2016-07-17 17:11 asciilifeform: the c-machine is an idiot foundation, which inevitably breeds the pests we are familiar with.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-17#1504226 << you know for the record i'm altogether unclear on this point.
a111: Logged on 2016-07-17 17:06 Framedragger: sure, open source culture is mostly a pile of crap, with little to no reflection on the culture *itself*, hard to disagree with you here.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-17#1504216 << isn't this kinda strange ? the sum total of their reflectivity is inept bullshit a la "how many women" etc. this is generally the halmark of stupid people, n'est pas.
mircea_popescu: sorta like "revolution was contemplated before" ; "yes, but not in the sense of beheading the king ~AND REPLACING IT WITH NO OTHER KING!~"
a111: Logged on 2016-07-17 17:03 Framedragger: (well to be true, 'throw away openssl' has been seriously contemplated by any a folk recently, i would wager a guess. but perhaps much less so with the latter, sure.)
hanbot: asciilifeform it's when they don't deliberately tent their fingers with evil glee (or alternatively, pet a sleeping cat from comfortable armchair) afore launching Plans to Set the Werld on Fire.
thestringpuller: shinohai: http://qntra.net/2016/07/steem-hacked/#comment-64481 << turns out it is "accidental ponzi" from mass adoption. conclusion: if all top posters pull their earnings price goes to 0 and everyone loses.
asciilifeform: '...all the grain needed to support a village fits in a hole so small you won't likely find it in a week of searching. A week you don't have.' << this led to many lulz during ru time of troubles in 1920s
asciilifeform: it is almost synonymous in my head with rzeczpospolita and the period.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: otr w/o the mandatory imperial shitstack.
a111: Logged on 2016-07-17 21:55 mircea_popescu: the notion that you WANT "instant" messaging is simply begging the question - you thereby and therefore DO NOT want secure, or workable, or sane.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-17#1504426 << at the risk of repeating ancient thread: real-time comms are ~costly~. because they leak bits that you may not wish leaked.
asciilifeform: are there even any extant 'otr' that don't pull in gtk, truetype, ..., etc. ?
asciilifeform: otp is the ~only~ thing that ~provably~ worx.
a111: Logged on 2016-07-17 22:00 mircea_popescu: it is not clear that otp actually works ; it is almost certain nothing else in the "pfs" gargle does.
Framedragger off to bed for the time being tho. laters.
mircea_popescu: Framedragger btw, since we're on this : you know the story of sobieski and his siege of piatra neamt ?
Framedragger: the latter seems hard on a practical level, even if very admirable. maybe it's a rationalization of my laziness, though
mircea_popescu: (and as a general rule, never read a summary unless you own the producer.)
mircea_popescu: i dunno, maybe it's opaque without a lot of other bits not directly obvious to me ; but until i hear better i'll continue to believe it directly works.
mircea_popescu: myeah. well... read the source material. fortunately the fellows were literate, and recorded in latin.
mircea_popescu: in its heyday, arguably the dominant power in europe.
mircea_popescu: you know that bit of history ? definitely worth reading, the fall of the republic of both nations.
mircea_popescu: what they do in the war room does not benefit from "near instantaenous". contrary to what the ustards in that position think.
mircea_popescu: whart we do here would suffer from delay ; but would not benefit from encryption. shit, there's a log anyway.
mircea_popescu: my point there is that you are confusing two incompatible things : the market and the general staff. there is exactly no overlap between these structurally dijunct items ; and entities that tried to use the same for both (example - classical polish-lithuanian commonwealth) failed miserably FOR THIS REASON.
mircea_popescu: why the fuck.
mircea_popescu: so you have it all, the warehouses bought, the parts delivered, drones are assembled and ready to. for whatever reason you need to syncronize this. and whaty you will do is...
Framedragger: but it was nice to understand where "gossip" comes from in gossipd: it's all about *not* providing any authenticity of source (beyond "this is coming from my wot")
mircea_popescu: this is insanity, though. suppose tomorrow you decide to implement say http://trilema.com/2013/nobody-could-have-foreseen-their-using-a-plane-like-a-rocket/
mircea_popescu: my evaluation of it was "rewrite" rather than "import" fwiw. but unlike tor, i have no beef with it as of yet.
mircea_popescu: it is not clear that otp actually works ; it is almost certain nothing else in the "pfs" gargle does.
Framedragger: mircea_popescu: sure, i see your point regarding implicit assumptions in "instant messaging" etc.; but on a technical point, they allow for pfs through 'session secrets' without having a bunch of pre-computed keys (unknown status of distaste @ these terms here)
a111: Logged on 2016-07-17 16:51 Framedragger: difficult to organize coups without the 'I'. the (shitty shitty) turkey coup used whatsapp incidentally
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-07-17#1504163 << and coups organized by people who don't know each other (to the degree that they actually use facebook.whatever)... fail. though the department of state idiocy in turkey was not even accomplished enough to merit the name of failure, properly speaking.
mircea_popescu: there's a lot of these strands of cocktopus stuck in each and every pie. how do you have "democratic" syria ? turns out that you don't - you either have "democratic" yet-another-flyover-state ; or else syria.
mircea_popescu: much like asking "how do you make working social security" skews the discussion into nonsense.
mircea_popescu: the notion that you WANT "instant" messaging is simply begging the question - you thereby and therefore DO NOT want secure, or workable, or sane.
asciilifeform: as soon as you start putting in the missing pieces to make the system actually usable in practice (e.g., no 15 second delay on 'ls' command) you end up with... linux.
mircea_popescu: this isn't just a happenstance. while it's probably not deliberately constructed, it's nevertheless a CONSTRUCT. ie, part of a culture, which depends on it.