asciilifeform: (glass, contrary to the mysteriously popular delusion, is ~not~ a liquid)
mircea_popescu: if identity is in fact "a set of deep habits" then you are a woman in the greek sense of that term ; and moreover i have nfi why you wouldn't be happy in the inca state.
mircea_popescu: the buddhist monk rescuing scorpion koan is directly linked here.
asciilifeform: and i can even see where mircea_popescu makes the cut, 'this is not same as to prefer the death'
mircea_popescu: yes, but it induces a whole slew of shit that then passes for thought.
asciilifeform: from refusal to take whatever else is on the table.
mircea_popescu: yes, "obvicously" what's "meant" is an approximation. then through practice that obvious goes away, much like rubber gloves one never changes or reviews,
mircea_popescu: the notion that one "prefers death" is very similar to "cut me e length of rope"
mircea_popescu: there's a long history of playing fast and loose with domain before one arrives at this wretched state where he "prefers complex numbers".
asciilifeform: rather than ask machinist to cut a complex length of steel
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform a man who is a plumber is not by this measure "a plague victim". yes, the man works in shit all day. but : he does the work in shit with shit tools, and then he presumably eats with eat tools. he doesn't mix the two.
asciilifeform: is it simply that engineer, at the end of the day, puts the complex nums back into their drawers ?
mircea_popescu: what's "manipulation" to do with it ? if you claimed you sat down to have tea with some complex numbers, i'd point out the batshit insanity of that notion just like above, yes.
mircea_popescu: no example is required to decide any dispute. the example is a teaching tool, not a reasoning tool.
mircea_popescu: the field is "deduction, or induction"
mircea_popescu: the field is not "argument from authority or argument from induction"
mircea_popescu: the field is not "argument from authority"
asciilifeform: i don't partake in the 'aristotelian' notion of correctness - 'do this because fella with a beard 3 metres long said it to be correct'. gotta show example of the kind of disaster one might arrive at via the incorrectness.
mircea_popescu: usefully at the destruction of correctly is pretty much the "western world" example.
asciilifeform: including the ideal of his own burning corpse, yes.
mircea_popescu: that it's present to you dun mean it's present to them.
asciilifeform: so how does this square up with the 'not present' item ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform they didn't, nor do i, nor does anyone capable of thinking.
asciilifeform: the other observation re the greeks is that they did ~not~, by any indication, believe that a man who walks headfront into his death is necessarily acting illogically.
thestringpuller: don't stab the messenger!
mircea_popescu: gtfo, by the same token elliot knows a lot about fucking ; and the exact-copies of him in charge of the circus act that in the us passes for finance now that the arabs have entirely decapitated it know a lot about bankruptcy
asciilifeform: idea is not 'know' but specifically reasoning about it in the mine field density sense.
mircea_popescu: i barf at the idea that you dicking around with a statistical model has allowed you to cogently discuss the actual events.
mircea_popescu: anyway, i'd guess you pivoted the definition. "milimort nonsense" refers to the ridiculous pretense that statistics discusses discrete events ; it is not a proposition that statistical aproaches to risk management are infeasible or their lingo inacceptable.
asciilifeform: or not? and if so where is the cut mircea_popescu draws.
asciilifeform: say i have option of walking through 2 minefields. one with 1 booby per 10 sq. m., the other - per 20.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform both the "milimort" nonsense and the "operate on own deaths" nonsense do. and it's not coincidental, you evidently build this crap on top of itself.
asciilifeform: even if 10,000,001 derps connect them.
mircea_popescu: it's one thing to say "most black people are uneployed". it is another thing to say "this man is unemmployed because black"
mircea_popescu: look here : risk, as a statistical concern, and phenomenology, as a discrete history of the world, are entirely separate domains.
mircea_popescu: moreover, the fact that folk are "stuck" operating on windows/other tiling wm "all the time" is really no excuse to smash your stack, as in
asciilifeform: the problem with the greek pov, as re-told by mircea_popescu, is that folks are still stuck logically operating on own deaths all the time, whether they like to or not.
mircea_popescu: (btw since stuprum, stupeo was mentioned, let's point out to trinque that the ancient word for rape actually denotes the very benumbment in question.)
mircea_popescu: whether it's nude or dressed discusses the pacification of society. common man tends to be (through herd socialisation) ... "upset" by nudity.
mircea_popescu: a nude call is a call that is not dressed. by parts : a call is an act of judgement, what's normally called "an expert call". when you produce through human heuristic a result that'd better be good enoughy because it's all there is.
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: and this sounds like a homework question.
asciilifeform: thestringpuller: it's a kernelism, debug the way sane people debug kernels, on emulator with gdb hose.
mircea_popescu: your calling induction "demonstration" and you pretending a nude call as to the future counts as either doth not actually change how reason works, you know.
asciilifeform: now demonstrate for the deaths thing.
thestringpuller: asciilifeform: probably not your foray, but asking for friend. what's the best way to debug "copy_from_user" without GDB (linux syscall)?
mircea_popescu: which is why all the scorn for their inevitable "oh but this rarely if ev er happens".
mircea_popescu: so wait, wait, if "nobody's key got compromised" then koch bug was no bug ?
asciilifeform switches on emulated mircea_popescutron, who answers with the inevitable mussolini quote
asciilifeform: if no crash, the bound was no bound.
mircea_popescu: going out of bounds is the exact equivalent in practice of the medieval notion of "losing communion with god". you're... lost.
asciilifeform: i.e. the div by 0, or overflow, etc.
asciilifeform: you gotta point out the absurdum yer reductio-ing this ad to.
mircea_popescu: the practical difference it makes is that if you stuprum definitions the results are - by definition - undefined. just like when you smash buffers, what you get is a no-longer-working machine. irrespective of what "practical" difference it makes understood as "i still see tiled windows so all is well"
mircea_popescu: the idea is to protect yourself from workplace injuries, not to embrace them. what is this, 1800s sulphur mine kids in sicily ? hunchback and sideways ?
asciilifeform: well i work with these for a living, what.
mircea_popescu: exact fucking definition of derealisation, as in the psychosis symptom. "can't distinguish between things present and things in own head."
mircea_popescu: this qualifies as insanity. wtf do you mean the realia-idealia is "distinction without a difference" ?
mircea_popescu: that whatever they pick, death isn't a present thing.
asciilifeform: what's the problem mircea_popescu has with this ?
asciilifeform: folks of rational and upstanding character pick deaths all the time. instead of betrayal, instead of retreat, dishonour, etc.
mircea_popescu: how the hell did you end up with the idea death is ? fucking ancients knew proof to the contrary.
mircea_popescu: and you're way too liberal with this "oh, bigint ? sure i'll smush a string in there!"
mircea_popescu: if they won't eat the cockroach, they don't have a preference, they just gave up, or whatever.
mircea_popescu: if they ate dragonflies rather than wasps, they'd have had a preference for dragonflies and preferred dragonflies.
asciilifeform: well they had two present things, insect protein, and death of starvation... picked the latter.
asciilifeform: ants are protein like any other...
asciilifeform: (re the ww2 folk who starved on account of refusing to eat insect)
mircea_popescu: and in further historical trilema lulz, http://trilema.com/2009/eu-am-un-succes-nebun-la-femei/
mircea_popescu: there is no such thing as "the preferences" of the virgin. virgins have no preferences.
mircea_popescu: when it's a case that your boss wants you to do overtime, his competitor wants you to move over and there's five headhunters heating your phone, THEN you consider it's time to ask for a raise.
mircea_popescu: when it's a case that you're already fucking tanja, jennifer, rachel and the bubblebutt sisters, and this hottie cinema user begs you to let her come in with you and massage your feet while you watch the movie, and you're too exhausted to think that's a good idea, THEN you start thinking what you prefer, and ditch some of the crowd.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform this hallucination of choice, "i am getting none and will tell you what i won't accept" is the universal symptom of elliot-idiocy not just in elliot, but in everyone. AFTER you get MORE than you can handle, THEN you can express preference. not before. never before.
mircea_popescu: sexuate copulation being, in ALL species, the absolute lowest bar conceivable. numeration is a higher achievement.
mircea_popescu: ver his "failure" (rather, deliberate avoidance) of cunt.
mircea_popescu: kid is a wonder to behold, he effortlessly succeeds at things virtually none of his compatriots ever do, such as killing people (note how many of the "i shot a buncha losers" types are actually first generation or further as opposed to malibu-beachouse-timesharing-lizzardkin) or keeping his nose clean (seriously, find someone in californa born 80s or prior who is not and will not smoke), and then is all bitter and butthurt o
mircea_popescu: cuz i had nfi there was anyone left in california who didn't ganja
asciilifeform: schmuck in bmw is just a schmuck in bmw, not a picker of chix, just as if asciilifeform were to put on a priceless 16th c. samurai armour, he would not thereby become a samurai.
a111: Logged on 2016-08-27 05:09 BingoBoingo: "Somehow the thought that he could have just taken that [shiny new BMW, by the way] ride of his over to Burbank or something and picked up one (or two, or three) of the black girls that perenially prop the street lights waiting for something [such as private movie theatres in Malibu mansions] to happen never occurs. Hell is other people for some people ; but apparently sometimes hell is just the hole in one's own head." << "And through w
asciilifeform: now if dope were something one could download! then.
a111: Logged on 2016-08-27 04:48 BingoBoingo: Starting to seem like the only thing that could have saved broken elliot would have been going all in on the booze. Not getting girls drunk, but getting himself black out drunk until he developed the alcoholism and his life became unmanageable for relateable reasons.
BingoBoingo: orking these steps we shall find a new Freedom and a new happiness... We will intuitively know how to handle situations which used to baffle us" (TM)(R)
BingoBoingo: "Somehow the thought that he could have just taken that [shiny new BMW, by the way] ride of his over to Burbank or something and picked up one (or two, or three) of the black girls that perenially prop the street lights waiting for something [such as private movie theatres in Malibu mansions] to happen never occurs. Hell is other people for some people ; but apparently sometimes hell is just the hole in one's own head." << "And through w
BingoBoingo: "Both my friends James and Philip seem to be the weak, accepting type; whereas I am the fighter. I will never stand to be insulted, and I will eventually have my revenge against all those who insult me, no matter how long it takes." << Dude needed a real enemy
BingoBoingo: Maybe he's get lucky and the B12 deficiency encephaly would break his brain into working
BingoBoingo: Starting to seem like the only thing that could have saved broken elliot would have been going all in on the booze. Not getting girls drunk, but getting himself black out drunk until he developed the alcoholism and his life became unmanageable for relateable reasons.
deedbot: http://trilema.com/2016/the-story-of-elliot-rodger-by-elliot-rodger-adnotated-part-sex/ << Trilema - The Story of Elliot Rodger. By Elliot Rodger. Adnotated. Part Sex.
asciilifeform: http://trilema.com/2016/the-story-of-elliot-rodger-by-elliot-rodger-adnotated-part-sex << oh hey.
a111: Logged on 2016-08-26 22:02 covertress: asciilifeform: if i do, you'll be the last to know
shinohai did it for the glory of Baal of course
lobbes: help page noted. I'll put it first in the queue
lobbes: of course, if I finally got to adding search on the logs, maybe it'd be easier to find this out :/
lobbes: but now it is there twice :P
a111: Logged on 2016-08-26 14:14 mircea_popescu: jurov now there is : http://logs.minigame.bz/2016-08-26.log.html#t14:13:32
lobbes: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1529720 << lol, lobbesbot has had this for a few months btw. It is supybot pretty much, so all the favorites are there: later, seen, calc, etc
mircea_popescu: but the point remains.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu's harem is typical american marriahe the way my battlestation is typical amer pc.
mircea_popescu: you seriously imagine fear of retribution keeps my harem together ?!
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the problem with your view it's that it's so damned adversarial.
pete_dushenski: https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-3uauu8ss8YY/V7-qnTD7JyI/AAAAAAAAnGQ/WUQ121zzWegsEQ77pLVhy_4iS2zTDThSACLcB/s640/NGFT8iIu1r4ddooUcbYeP9eWY_XCjenfVugh0sQGf38.jpg << that's one way to use an old stadium (in osaka). cost-effective at least. /me wonders about property values in the interior
pete_dushenski: not like persians didn't try to make own hoplites, but inevitably ended up buying existing mercs because short-term it was the only practicable solution
asciilifeform: the jews of old europe understood this, and - best as i know - NEVER invoked the goyish judicial system on whatever pretext, when dispute was wholly internal
asciilifeform: and eventually devolves to the usual 'star topology'.
asciilifeform: but to copy it you need a reasonably self-contained tribal machine for settling disputes, otherwise devolves to a contest of who can invoke usg library calls to moar effect.
pete_dushenski: there's no solutions for everyone - not homogeneous group!1
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: strictly the set of folk who dun have a hassan and ibrahim.
asciilifeform: mega-solution for the rest of us.
asciilifeform: folks who do not fall into one of these clans, end up in the inca's star topology and get raped.
asciilifeform: just ask the mormons, nyc hassids, etc.
asciilifeform: if you run a sufficiently tight imperium in imperio, usg gets to bite its elbows and you can get away with pretty much anything, so long as the wall is tall enough.
mircea_popescu: but the overarching, important point is that "some whore" is by far your best ally, and sharpest instrument.
asciilifeform: which is what they typically do.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: if you meritwash the kid and appoint him as director of the usual faux charity/corp/etc. usg gets 0.
asciilifeform: but interestingly the right to invoke the usg support mechanism ~cannot be signed away~ in usa.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there's a whole array of settlements and structured etcs available. moreover, if you keep that money and kid inherits it, usg steals 60% not 20%
asciilifeform: if it is a 'silent understanding' in, e.g., amicable divorce - then no usg vig
asciilifeform: if it is arranged via official channels, and is legally termed 'child support' - as in , was sued for - then it is.
asciilifeform: who then passes on ~80% of it.
pete_dushenski: i've heard of this 'blackholing money' thing. was all the rage circa 2007/8
mircea_popescu: back to the topic : if you're rich, it's probably a bad idea for fiscal reasons to skimp on child support.
asciilifeform: they can move money into inaccessible universes.
asciilifeform: 'rich people' in the usual sense do not have this problem.
asciilifeform: esp. among the breeding class.
mircea_popescu: ie, sooner or later you will want to transfer some money to these children. do it sooner rather than later, escape some tax burden
pete_dushenski: greenspun, despite appearing to be happily married and fathering and what have you, is ~obsessed~ with alimony / child support / no fault divorce litigation in the states. he openly advocates that young ladies skip 'career' and instead have illegitimate children with lawyers, dentists, school principals, etc.
mircea_popescu: look : the entire profession of estate lawyer is this : "you want to transfer X sugar from A to B ; with ants eating as little as possible on the way. This is how you time-attack the ants :"
asciilifeform: the fiction is that it has something to do with what it costs to grow a kid, but the reality does not at all resemble the fiction.
asciilifeform: and the 'child support' thing is wholly separate from alimony and contracts have 0 effect.
mircea_popescu: there is also that.
asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: in the anglo world, it is 'unnecessary' in the same way bleeding-as-medicine is. i.e. unless you are a lizard, judge will piss on your prenup.
pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: hm ? i mean the snowforts of giza and whatnot.
a111: Logged on 2016-08-26 14:30 thestringpuller: so: "Holla, "We want prenup! We want prenup!" (Yeah!)"
pete_dushenski: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1529760 << incidentally, a prenup is entirely unnecessary with the advent of bitcoin. but i guess we can forgive kanye given the age of that particular tune.
a111: Logged on 2016-08-26 22:02 covertress: asciilifeform: if i do, you'll be the last to know
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1530099 << lol alf, you got a way with teh ladies, brings out the icy in 'em!
pete_dushenski: speaking of which, cheers to mircea_popescu for the elliot chronicles! i loled many, many times
pete_dushenski: i may not have grown up in former su, but the arctic is its own kind of strange parallel universe requiring altogether mesmerising adaptations
BingoBoingo: If there were complaints though I'd expect them to actually have increased over the past two weeks as I've taken to walking around with athletic black girl to trigger fat white bitches into hopefully eating less.
asciilifeform: 'He said Nextdoor has added “racial profiling” as a category for people who want to flag a conversation as inappropriate and that it has provided additional training on how to recognize toxic conversations about race to the volunteer “neighborhood leads” who are responsible for moderating discussions.'
asciilifeform: it was written by the fella whose diesel-powered cock you were considering to encompass, covertress . i recommend reading attentively.
covertress: asciilifeform: if i do, you'll be the last to know
a111: Logged on 2016-08-26 17:25 mircea_popescu: has anyone a spare bedroom/garage/whatever willing to rent to me for a reasoble sum and park gabriel there for a few months ?
mircea_popescu: lol. gawker is about freedom in the sense putin is about gay sex.
asciilifeform: or 'how shitgnomes suture their wounds'
asciilifeform: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/dad3c494-6e89-4cd5-98a4-7d767786a855/?raw=true << in other recent lulz
asciilifeform: https://thehackerblog.com/floating-domains-taking-over-20k-digitalocean-domains-via-a-lax-domain-import-system/index.html << related.
phf: hmm, there's no exceptions, bot's simply timing out. i wonder if i should put a reconnect throttle. i wouldn't be surprised if the ping is timing out, but a connection can still go through. so bot times out, then reconnects, then one ping goes through, another one times out, so bot disconnects again..
BingoBoingo: "The court ruled that because the law that defines stealing doesnt include the value of property stolen as an element of the offense, prosecutors couldnt charge the woman in the case with felony stealing."
phf: thestringpuller: yes
phf: asciilifeform: i don't know what that was, i'll have to read the log/code but probably sometime later tonight. fwiw it reconnects
deedbot: http://thestringpuller.com/2016/08/metcalfes-lie/ << Pull Your Own Strings - Metcalfe’s Lie
deedbot: http://thestringpuller.com/2016/07/slockit-enables-scamming/ << Pull Your Own Strings - Slockit Enables Scamming
deedbot: http://thestringpuller.com/2016/07/a-steeming-bubble/ << Pull Your Own Strings - A Steeming Bubble
deedbot: http://thestringpuller.com/2016/07/closing-the-loop/ << Pull Your Own Strings - Closing the Loop
deedbot: http://thestringpuller.com/2016/07/consumers-revolt/ << Pull Your Own Strings - Consumers Revolt
deedbot: http://thestringpuller.com/2016/07/mass-adoption-as-a-ponzi-scheme/ << Pull Your Own Strings - Mass Adoption as a Ponzi Scheme
deedbot: http://thestringpuller.com/2016/06/outer-heaven/ << Pull Your Own Strings - Outer Heaven
deedbot: http://thestringpuller.com/2016/06/bitcoin-wont-hardfork-any-time-soon/ << Pull Your Own Strings - Bitcoin Won’t Hardfork Any Time Soon
deedbot: http://thestringpuller.com/2016/06/the-coinbase-implosion-timer/ << Pull Your Own Strings - The Coinbase Implosion Timer
deedbot: http://thestringpuller.com/2016/06/bitcoin-in-wakanda/ << Pull Your Own Strings - Bitcoin in Wakanda
mircea_popescu: typical retirement for aged 2nd tier whores. they have just enough connections to make the whole thing work.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform think of it as sewage filter. dunno if you've seen ossessione, but anyway : the street blows by all sorts, maybe some junk you'd like to hold on for a while.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: they are more like your german shepherd.
mircea_popescu: i also saw them in every red light district
BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> has anyone a spare bedroom/garage/whatever willing to rent to me for a reasoble sum and park gabriel there for a few months ? << Parking him in my spider hole would be bad for my sobriety
asciilifeform: i also saw them in chicago
asciilifeform: (there are students panhandling for tuition at schools like uni of md, which doesn't cost a fifth of what stanford costs)
asciilifeform: then again if he genuinely went broke, was probably booted
asciilifeform: don't they give'em barracks to live in?
mircea_popescu: has anyone a spare bedroom/garage/whatever willing to rent to me for a reasoble sum and park gabriel there for a few months ?
trinque: crossed the cultural streams!
asciilifeform: trinque: i specifically did not mean 'ansifier', as in your caca, or the infamous 'ascii starwars', but purposeful ansi-drawing.
asciilifeform: they had 'gui' made out of ansi chars.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no argument re no-ip-and-raptor scheme. the deeper point for me is that the advances happen so quickly and are so significant that it's yet early.
trinque: sounds like it turns into the web browser "supports 9999 devices and browser versions" which has never actually been a thing
asciilifeform: 80x25 motherfuckers.
trinque: they banned gabriel_laddel for beating on some fucknut that thought ncurses clim ought to be a thing
trinque: nothing even worth the mention. they're the types that cry for their mothers when an aggressive argument is brought.
trinque: ;;later tell gabriel_laddel good luck wringing something usable from those people; they're idiots.
asciilifeform: (this also makes for a clean transition to comms over shortwave, hijacked tv satellites, or whatever other twist the future holds where packets come with NO return address)
asciilifeform: pound the knife in it.
asciilifeform: s, as can mine, and traffic between them cannot be grouped into 'a conversation between x and y' by third party.
a111: Logged on 2016-08-26 16:06 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1529659 << and timing attacks, of course. of all numerous kinds - suppose as a banal example that what i want to do is discern whether key X is yours or his. well, a simple solution would be to add a third i know is not involved, send the same thing to all three, and see which of the susperct two behaves like the third.
asciilifeform: one other point re http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1529877 is that divorcing from 'a node is an ip' entirely, makes this or any variant of this attack considerably more painful. with single-packet quanta, and raptor code (i.e. it does not matter whether mircea_popescu gets all of my packets in order, but only that he gets 10% of the packets i send in next second, in SOME order) his 'node' could consist of 15 machines in 6 continent
asciilifeform: happens rather often here, doesnit.
mircea_popescu: took me all of 2 seconds, and i thought "funny how this works, where one man's stumped another man sees not the trouble"
asciilifeform: THERE we go.
mircea_popescu: oh right, we had this with the german museum o' crypto
asciilifeform: that's the 'fingerprint of how it types' thread
asciilifeform: by making the machine draw same current regardless of what keys are pressed, or if any are
asciilifeform: where they countered differential power analysis
mircea_popescu: but at least it become evident from this discussion that we'll prolly bundle a performancer, ie something to benchmark key parts of the crypto lib on machines for the user's benefit.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: running safety-critical code on pc ~is~ a hack, and there is no way fully around it except to burn the pc.
asciilifeform: the job of the algo is to perform same count of 'ideal cpu, no cache, all instr take the cycle count printed in the book' instructions per sig verif.
asciilifeform: (e.g., i cannot know the rate at which mircea_popescu's reactor control card throws interrupts, or how many cpu core he has to handle them with, etc.)
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the ceiling is necessarily machine-specific
mircea_popescu: and then what do you do
mircea_popescu: and if you do it in this manner, then yes, it is theoretically possible that i make your program run for longer than the specified interval
BingoBoingo: "The sheriffs office said deputies and Pinckneyville police officers received a call at 9:18 a.m. Saturday for reckless driving. Nine minutes later, officers tried to stop a blue 2016 Ford Hatchback, which failed to stop, the sheriffs office said. An officer had to pull in front of the Ford to block it to force the vehicle to stop."
mircea_popescu: except the controls aren't controllable.
mircea_popescu: anyway, a device would be neat, but i'm persuaded it won't be the first thing.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform uh. so now you're married to hardware ? why even do it software then, make gossipd a chip
mircea_popescu: even if written in straight asm, i doubt the time ceiling can be guaranteed in this manner
mircea_popescu: then processor will cache who knows where
mircea_popescu: you at some point wrote a c program which, when compiled anywhere, resulted in the same COUNT of cpu cycles being used ?
asciilifeform: there are no magic cases.
mircea_popescu: so then how exactly is this supposed to work.
mircea_popescu: if ceiling is absolute, if the program fails to produce output in interval, it'll have to put out error
asciilifeform: whether for univac or pc.
asciilifeform: just like any other proggy.
asciilifeform: then you catch the author of the code, hang him upside-down, and beat with a long bamboo pole.
mircea_popescu: suppose i can get a process to overrun the time ceiling.
asciilifeform: solves the differential timing problem strictly.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the ceiling is a dirty hack. there's no practical way to guarantee it solves the problem.
a111: Logged on 2016-08-26 16:06 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1529659 << and timing attacks, of course. of all numerous kinds - suppose as a banal example that what i want to do is discern whether key X is yours or his. well, a simple solution would be to add a third i know is not involved, send the same thing to all three, and see which of the susperct two behaves like the third.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1529877 << timing can be 'ceilinged' and it solves problem. but i am still chewing on the problem of enemy being able to determine who is speaking to whom by deriving the public keys. (this is trivial with rsa, and i've been working on answering the q of whether is is also true for c-s)
mircea_popescu: yes, but it cuts a chunk of the domain which is conveniently choseb
asciilifeform: it is general in the sense where, if you include it, 'sybil' is no longer meaningful concept
a111: Logged on 2016-08-26 16:03 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1529656 << this is correct ; there's no general solution to sybil problem ; this is not unrelated to http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-25#1529170
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1529874 << the general solution is wot + nothing-to-allcomers.
BingoBoingo: Roundup Xtend 3 is going to be pretty full with all of the week's almost news.
mircea_popescu: THIS is the important point of security. not "you can't", but "of course you can - which would you prefer"
mircea_popescu: attacker is very free to discover any topology he likes, much in the way attacker is welcome to decipher otp message to anything he pleases.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1529659 << and timing attacks, of course. of all numerous kinds - suppose as a banal example that what i want to do is discern whether key X is yours or his. well, a simple solution would be to add a third i know is not involved, send the same thing to all three, and see which of the susperct two behaves like the third.
a111: Logged on 2016-08-25 03:13 phf: hehe, actually ambush strategy is one of the reasons there's no known solutions for general networks, which must be a bummer for dod
a111: Logged on 2016-08-26 13:04 phf: i don't think there's a solution to drowned in sibyl's in general. there's a cost to validating counterparty (which is continuous in case of gossipd, there's no "validate the ip, and then trust it" which is what i mean by "no trust in ip"), which can be exploited by attacker.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1529656 << this is correct ; there's no general solution to sybil problem ; this is not unrelated to http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-25#1529170
mircea_popescu: everyting "can be construed as trust" if one has this scalar notion of trust. "here is what body doing X thing reported its IP to be at the time it was doing the X thing" is a very different statement from "i expect to find my house at the corner of cunt street with shit creek"
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1529648 << so then does your ssh key exporter trust ips ?
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-26#1529634 << well i used the article in which you show an inclination to evanghelism ; rather than the other one.
mircea_popescu: or how did they call this in ru ? where lenin's wife went, and all the other ambitious wives followed