Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2014-06-08 | 2014-06-10 → ↓
TheNewDeal: bitcoin network needs some steriods this week
mircea_popescu: ;;estimate
gribble: Next difficulty estimate | 11861036168.8 based on data since last change | 11960937288.6 based on data for last three days
BingoBoingo: I'd be thrilled if it stalled out until Bastille Day
Mats_cd03: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 304889 | Current Difficulty: 1.1756551916903952E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 306431 | Next Difficulty In: 1542 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 3 days, 8 hours, 22 minutes, and 33 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 11876740684.2 | Estimated Percent Change: 1.02231
TheNewDeal: I'm updating TheNewDeals estimate to 4.8% increase
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27213 @ 0.00085428 = 23.2475 BTC [+] {2}
TheNewDeal: still looks like there should be a third change unless things start going backwards
TheNewDeal: ;;calc (14/11.756)^(1/3)
gribble: Error: Something in there wasn't a valid number.
TheNewDeal: ;;calc (14/11.756)**(1/3)
gribble: 1.05996002345
benkay: wowee. 4.8% you say?
TheNewDeal: my model is with starting hashrate of 83.5 PH and a daily growth rate of 1.0095
TheNewDeal: trying to be conservative
TheNewDeal: I'm pretty noobish at modeling a random walk though
TheNewDeal: so I skipped that
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1609 @ 0.00085274 = 1.3721 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: !up btamm13
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18791 @ 0.00084926 = 15.9584 BTC [-]
benkay: TheNewDeal: care to take a guess at when the diff will finally reverse?
TheNewDeal: ohmygosh
TheNewDeal: I haven't the slightest clue
TheNewDeal: http://bitcoin.sipa.be/growth.png this one makes it look like august/september (if the trend continues*)
TheNewDeal: I've got a lot of my stake invested in the Bastille Day, starting to make me sweat
mircea_popescu: later all.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17600 @ 0.00085509 = 15.0496 BTC [+] {2}
TheNewDeal: peace
thestringpuller: IDIFF may be a better bet to make overall
TheNewDeal: idiff?
TheNewDeal: oh, I'm not on mpex unfortunately
TheNewDeal: not nearly as rich as you all
TheNewDeal: I felt the desire to take a risk with an a decent amount of my capital on something that actually can be calculated easily
TheNewDeal: getting very tired with btc price bets
thestringpuller: i don't use mpex
thestringpuller: just coinbr
TheNewDeal: ooooh
thestringpuller: i'm also one of the few people here who's fiat cashflow > crypto cash flow
TheNewDeal: who runs that?
TheNewDeal: wait a second
TheNewDeal: those x.diff look underpriced
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 71926 @ 0.00085021 = 61.1522 BTC [-] {4}
TheNewDeal: ahhh maybe it's pretty accurate
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9850 @ 0.00085564 = 8.4281 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 304890 | Current Difficulty: 1.1756551916903952E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 306431 | Next Difficulty In: 1541 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 3 days, 8 hours, 12 minutes, and 53 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 11879938287.0 | Estimated Percent Change: 1.04951
TheNewDeal: gribble is such a copycat
TheNewDeal: totally just updated my prediction to 4.8%
cazalla: don't sweat it TheNewDeal, it's a lock
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27883 @ 0.00084734 = 23.6264 BTC [-] {2}
thestringpuller: it might not happen before June IDIFF settles
thestringpuller: the diff change
thestringpuller: if it does...
TheNewDeal: I've got the diff change happening around 06:00 on 6/18 GMT time
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15717 @ 0.00084622 = 13.3 BTC [-] {2}
thestringpuller: that's after
TheNewDeal: that's with a 13.35 day total time between diff changes
thestringpuller: it settles
TheNewDeal: it said midnight of thi no?rd wednesday, or 6/18
TheNewDeal: it said midnight of third wednesday, or 6/18, no?
thestringpuller: oh i guess 11:59 on 6/18
TheNewDeal: 23:59
thestringpuller: yea or that
thestringpuller: hmm, gonna be close
thestringpuller: ;;google why does claire danes never age?
gribble: Claire Danes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claire_Danes>; Claire Danes - Biography - IMDb: <http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000132/bio>; Claire Danes Biography - Facts, Birthday, Life Story - Biography.com: <http://www.biography.com/people/claire-danes-20691429>
TheNewDeal: ;;google photoshop
gribble: Photoshop Inspiration, Photoshop Information | Photoshop.com: <http://www.photoshop.com/>; Photoshop Online Tools | Photoshop.com: <http://www.photoshop.com/tools>; Download Photoshop CC by joining Creative Cloud today | Adobe ...: <http://www.adobe.com/products/photoshop.html>
assbot: claire danes - Google Search
TheNewDeal: but she does look like she non-ages well
TheNewDeal: that's kinda neat that all mpex people can create i.diff futures
Mats_cd03: claire danes is scary
TheNewDeal: pretty good looking in my opinion
TheNewDeal: cazalla would you like to buy some of my exposure to the bastille day bet?
cazalla: i've already bet yes so i'll pass
cazalla: dw, it's like the Oklahoma Michigan bet and nobody had that one
TheNewDeal: not familiar with the one you're referring to
cazalla: the one with the crooked fkn zebras
TheNewDeal: whaaaaaaaaat
cazalla: ha sorry :P
TheNewDeal: sorry, still lost me here
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8750 @ 0.00085147 = 7.4504 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 4000 @ 0.00005366 = 0.2146 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27650 @ 0.00085125 = 23.5371 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41100 @ 0.00085102 = 34.9769 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23500 @ 0.00085081 = 19.994 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6250 @ 0.00085074 = 5.3171 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30490 @ 0.00085066 = 25.9366 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 81595 @ 0.00085596 = 69.8421 BTC [+] {3}
fluffypony: ;;later tell benkay F.OLD as the symbol?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.07270056 = 0.727 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32550 @ 0.00084983 = 27.662 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28341 @ 0.00085549 = 24.2454 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 10 @ 0.0232046 = 0.232 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 10 @ 0.0232021 = 0.232 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.07200041 = 0.72 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 9 @ 0.0250331 = 0.2253 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 20 @ 0.0235962 = 0.4719 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.07200031 = 0.432 BTC [-] {2}
Namworld: CBTC is still valued quite high.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 19 @ 0.02327155 = 0.4422 BTC [-] {2}
jurov: <benkay> [00:00:24] no no, coinbr resolves to hookers << what?
Namworld: The mermaid, he must recognize her, must be one of his local hookers.
Namworld: That's the most logical explanation I can find, and it's not very logical, but eh.
fluffypony: this is classic
assbot: Neo & Bee talk (spam free thread)
fluffypony: "havelock should hv done their checks on him and not offer scam companies."
fluffypony: if only.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23296 @ 0.0008566 = 19.9554 BTC [+]
Namworld: What kind of checks can they run at all anyway? Dox people? Seems limited to that.
fluffypony: Namworld: I think that a starting point would be historicity
fluffypony: which is what the WoT provides
fluffypony: the person is a) known, b) trusted by some when trading / lending / borrowing / dealing, c) has been around for a while, d) has not absconded with funds in the history of their presence on the WoT
fluffypony: just a starting point, mind you
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 5 @ 0.05051919 = 0.2526 BTC [-] {3}
jurov: this is how england worked, back when it was still a respectable country, up until the socialist revolution of the 80s. << lol if only margie t. heard you
jurov: <assbot> [00:33:43] BtcAlpha.com F.MPIF Tracker << kakobrekla you said you don't do assbot ad slots :D
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 1000 @ 0.0003 = 0.3 BTC [+]
assbot: BtcAlpha.com F.MPIF Tracker estimated NAV per share: 0.00021704 BTC (Total: 434.10 BTC). Last trade for F.MPIF on MPEX was at 0.00021725 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: !jd mpif
assbot: Current MPIF account balance on Just-Dice: 170.51197619 BTC; +0.01696697 BTC (+0.0100%) since last check 7h 8m 41s ago.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24900 @ 0.00085413 = 21.2678 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 359 @ 0.0003 = 0.1077 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: %ticker
atcbot: [X-BT] Bid: 144 Ask: 270 Last Price: 273 24h-Vol: 0k High: N/A Low: N/A VWAP: N/A
Namworld: fluffypony, the real world doesn't care about reality. You dox people and that's it.
Namworld: You don't dig for dirt.
fluffypony: Namworld: but what does knowing their real identity do? they could have run all sorts of scams and just not (yet) been caught, they could have had out-of-court settlements and all sorts
fluffypony: or even worse - they could be 100% genuine and yet still be involved in completely baseless court action that someone has taken against them (pissed off ex-girlfriend or ex-employee or ex-business-partner)
Namworld: If there's no criminal record, it's good enough. Notice I said the real world didn't care about REALITY.
Namworld: So I'm well aware of those issues... but not everyone will run proper background checks.
assbot: Malaysian Online Retailer Accepts Bitcoin, Won't Convert to Fiat Currency
fluffypony: KILL THE MALAYSIAN PRIME MINISTER!
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: OMG going to get banned from Twitter nao!!!
fluffypony: I was just quoting Derek Zoolander - ban HIM from Twitter!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11600 @ 0.00085243 = 9.8882 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 468 @ 0.00203981 = 0.9546 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16700 @ 0.00085224 = 14.2324 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18200 @ 0.00085718 = 15.6007 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27290 @ 0.00084992 = 23.1943 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: DARPA Program Seeks to Use Brain Implants to Control Mental Illness | MIT Technology Review
jurov: here we go, govt-approved mental states
jurov: !up lamosty
jurov: !up xe4l
assbot: Gay bomb - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
jurov: !up Evolyn
jurov: !up equex
jurov: !up Poffertje
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34200 @ 0.00084619 = 28.9397 BTC [-] {2}
jurov: !up deafboy
jurov: pankkake: i really hope these electrodes end up as ignobel candidates, too
Namworld: I really hope the "mentally ill" group doesn't include the whole Earth population
pankkake: they're already feeding a large chunk of the population with antidepressants
FabianB: kakobrekla: thanks, works great :)
Namworld: I was more hinting about technology eventually reaching brain control chip level and the technology being applied to everyone. Because let's face it 1. The brain is mechanical 2. You can control just about any sort of machine given the time to develop the approriate tools 3. Someone at some point in time will try to get it installed on everyone for selfish purposes.
pankkake: well, that's the next step
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5410 @ 0.0008472 = 4.5834 BTC [+]
Namworld: Eh, misuse of new technologies for the purpose of enslavement is nothing new.
jurov: the brain is not "mechanical" in contemporary technology sense. it's wetware with myriads of interlocking electrochemical processes
Namworld: Yes, I didn't mean mechanical in that fashion. More that chemical reactions are akin to machines. Although I guess it's not good practice to speak casually like that.
jurov: do we really have such machines? i don't think so
punkman: the technology of the demagogue is as old as dirt, who needs brain-controlling computars
jurov: even neural network simulators were found to have weakness - researchers were able to imperceptibly (to humans) change the samples which the neural networks miscategorized
jurov: punkman can post-traumatic depression be cured by demagogy?
Namworld: I never said we were there yet. The brain is extremely complex. So many molecules of all kinds, complex structures.
punkman: jurov, I'd guess it can
Namworld: Simulating/scanning a live one properly and actually controlling thoughts through simulations and predictions of inputs effects would probably require computing power and an amount of energy that just isn't realistically feasible for centuries.
assbot: Tailspotting: Identifying and Profiting from CEO Vacation Trips by David Yermack :: SSRN
Namworld: But given the time to get the tools to do it, it's not unrealistic. It falls under the current known laws of physics.
Namworld: Unlike other things like wormholes and FTL through space compression, which are not yet falling within certain laws of physics and aren't thought to be likely. The conditions needed to make that happen are huge and uncertain.
jurov: well.. that's such positivist statment
jurov: tell me, what will mpoe trade for next month?
jurov: that falls under laws of physics, too :D
Namworld: We'll probably have brain control chips before we can get outside the solar system, assuming we're not wiped out by some cataclysmic event first.
Namworld: Well, I guess, but to predict that accurately, wouldn't I need to accurately simulate all brains in the world, including the Earth and all stellar input that affect those brains?
xmj: solar flares?
jurov: what if brain activity gets proven to be incomputable?
Namworld: Which is even worse.... when it comes to finances, we have experience of what works and doesn't, what's good signs and doesn't, and guesstimating
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27477 @ 0.00085276 = 23.4313 BTC [+]
Namworld: Well I'd be a bit surprised, but yes. That's always possible.
jurov: what's surprising?
jurov: even most 100-byte asm programs can't be determined whether they'll eventually finish and how
jurov: but hooray, let's simulate billions of neurons
jurov: brb
punkman: I have a working reddit brain simulator
Namworld: It's a very small amount of matter compared to the universe. I'd assume we can refine technology close enough to simulate it accurately, or almost, given the resources out there.
punkman: it only ever outputs "lol" though
Namworld: I'm sure if you could simulate the whole of the system running your 100-byte asm programs, you'd be able to determine when it would eventually finish.
Namworld: It's really about simulating a complete system of interacting atoms.
Namworld: But enough distant future hypothetical scenarios, it's not like it has any usefulness, other than maybe entertaining oneself.
Namworld: It's 5:50 am, I need sleep, and I'm vastly out of topic for this channel I think, mostly rambling and talking to myself.
Namworld: So goodnight everyone, I'll go before I spout out too much more nonsense.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28750 @ 0.00084814 = 24.384 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14200 @ 0.00084814 = 12.0436 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11775 @ 0.00084697 = 9.9731 BTC [-] {2}
kakobrekla: jurov just giving credit where the credit is due.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24600 @ 0.00084931 = 20.893 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34102 @ 0.00084653 = 28.8684 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 313 @ 0.0020495 = 0.6415 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13300 @ 0.00084736 = 11.2699 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.07330217 = 0.1466 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21000 @ 0.00084609 = 17.7679 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1581 @ 0.00084605 = 1.3376 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: ;;seen Naphex
gribble: Naphex was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 15 hours, 12 minutes, and 48 seconds ago: <Naphex> o/
assbot: Piete, intreprinzatori, tehnologii, chestii. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: FabianB sent.
mircea_popescu: ;;seen littlep1
gribble: littlep1 was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 18 hours, 9 minutes, and 26 seconds ago: <Littlep1> he sent me an email about the corporate failures list threatening to sue me
mircea_popescu: so was this a kinda lame attempt at social engineering or what.
mircea_popescu: Namworld: What kind of checks can they run at all anyway? Dox people? Seems limited to that. << if they don't know why are they pretending to be in business ? "oh, doctors should diagnose people not feed them random pills" "what diagnose can they do anyway"
mircea_popescu: this is how england worked, back when it was still a respectable country, up until the socialist revolution of the 80s. << lol if only margie t. heard you << "During her premiership Thatcher had the second-lowest average approval rating, at 40 percent, of any post-war Prime Minister. "
mircea_popescu: let's not blame the wrong gal for people's brains turning to shit.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 36 @ 0.25001666 = 9.0006 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.2454 = 0.7362 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 54 @ 0.24500666 = 13.2304 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13258 @ 0.00084736 = 11.2343 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 4500 @ 0.00005499 = 0.2475 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21815 @ 0.00084929 = 18.5273 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9600 @ 0.00085305 = 8.1893 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 200 @ 0.01886788 = 3.7736 BTC [-] {25}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 100 @ 0.00382684 = 0.3827 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: Namworld: fluffypony, the real world doesn't care about reality. << more like the reverse. reality doesn't care for whatever set you happen to have mislabeled as "the real world". probably a selection of terminally unemployable couch surfing webexperts.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 10000 @ 0.00005033 = 0.5033 BTC [-] {7}
Apocalyptic: in other news, ATC price graphs from x-bt on http://atc.blockr.io/
Mats_cd03: hue hue hue
mircea_popescu: Namworld Because let's face it 1. The brain is mechanical << you know what else lets-face-it-is-mechanical ? the fucking atom.
mircea_popescu: or wait, notrly.
mircea_popescu: Apocalyptic nice1
mircea_popescu: ;;seen thickasthieves
gribble: thickasthieves was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 2 days, 12 hours, 34 minutes, and 15 seconds ago: <ThickAsThieves> raccoons are like idiot cats
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell ThickAsThieves <Apocalyptic> in other news, ATC price graphs from x-bt on http://atc.blockr.io/
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: 10 blocks in 25 minutes too, nuts.
Apocalyptic: yeah unbalanced has rent some hashpower
mircea_popescu: jurov: punkman can post-traumatic depression be cured by demagogy? << yes if full specter. probably not if randomly limited.
mircea_popescu: !up joesmoe
joesmoe: test
joesmoe: awesome thanks man
mircea_popescu: lol ok i'll stfu with namworld's 1800s ideas about the brain, jurov handed him his ass pretty admirably :D
mircea_popescu: punkman: it only ever outputs "lol" though << must be only simulating the left brain
mircea_popescu: joesmoe did you want to say something ?
joesmoe: nah i just wanted to join in the convo
joesmoe: was more interested in the conversation you were having the other day about south america
joesmoe: but didn't get back until it was laready over.
mircea_popescu: well im sure there's going to be another
joesmoe: i was thinking about heading down there about 6 months ago before all the china stuff blrew up
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4508 @ 0.00085305 = 3.8455 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: wait how did china blow up ?
assbot: Alpha-male bear facing castration as sexual dominance threatens population | Environment | theguardian.com
mircea_popescu: haha hopefully the bears get food stamps next.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13400 @ 0.00085265 = 11.4255 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: http://pgp.cs.uu.nl/plot/ this is kinda interesting stuff
assbot: analysis of the strong set in the PGP web of trust
mircea_popescu: (i am in the strong set. are you ?)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7000 @ 0.00085158 = 5.9611 BTC [-]
assbot: Kim Dotcom offers $5m for legal help | Stuff.co.nz
mircea_popescu: but is it in bitcoin
mircea_popescu: "We are asking for information that proves unlawful or corrupt conduct by the US government, the New Zealand government, spy agencies, law enforcement and Hollywood"
mircea_popescu: but... i thought he already had it etc
pankkake: how do you tell if you're in the strong set?
mircea_popescu: "The strong set is the largest set of keys such that for any two keys in the set, there is a path from one to the other."
mircea_popescu: basically the wot here enforces strong setness by default
Mats_cd03: won't be in btc which is a shame
mircea_popescu: pankkake you're not in it. at least not with D9889CC0
Mats_cd03: 7700BTC is a powerful incentive
pankkake: if you're on the website, then you're on the strong set
pankkake: I'm in it with other key(s) :)
mircea_popescu: neither is kako :D
mircea_popescu: pankkake prollybest link them then ?
assbot: PGP trust paths : Mircea Popescu -> Luke Dashjr
pankkake: I'd rather not sign it, pankkake is an anonymous entity
pankkake: perhaps I could let other anonymouses I met IRL sign me, but how do they check I am myself?!
pankkake: (though my old key was signed by a person I've known for years)
pankkake: and it is in the strong set. I guess I could get in there by signing the old key in the other direction
mircea_popescu: check this shit out, otherthan luke and peter todd, nobody in my bitcoin wot is in the pgp strong set
mircea_popescu: yer all a buncher newbs!
los_pantalones: mircea_popescu what's a strong set?
assbot: #bitcoin-assets log
jurov: !up mdev
jurov: !up dR3
jurov: !up daybyter
jurov: !up lnostdal
dR3: thx jurov
jurov: dR3 you got your half hour of glory, speak up :)
kakobrekla: argle bargle im not a newb im just anon.
jurov: today is IPO, tomorrow is glory
mircea_popescu: jurov what ipo is that ?
assbot: MPEx, the Bitcoin securities exchange.
assbot: Now is Time, tomorrow IS glory = IPO people
mircea_popescu: lmao ok this is pretty great stuff
fluffypony: that was my favourite
fluffypony: I really enjoyed that
mircea_popescu: we still don;t know who these are ?
fluffypony: I already said I was proslimbs_inc
fluffypony: but nobody pays attention
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 10 @ 0.02500111 = 0.25 BTC [+]
daybyter: any java coder here interested in trading code?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.0735299 = 0.2206 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14308 @ 0.00085265 = 12.1997 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla a likely story :D
mircea_popescu: fluffypony arighjt right
mircea_popescu: pretty funny pony :D
mircea_popescu: <daybyter> any java coder here interested in trading code? << whoa just like the old days!
mike_c: hey nubbins`. how's life.
FabianB: mircea_popescu: the file is encrypted for you, can you reencrypt it with my key?
nubbins`: not bad, backing up & wiping my iphone so i can send it in for replacement
nubbins`: so which of you has been leaving ;;later tells for "nubbins" and "nubbins`i"
nubbins`: ;;notes
gribble: I currently have notes waiting for agentx24, anarkitty, bakinat, bcb, benkay, bitcoingirl, cevidad, congrats, davout, Immukization, Immuzikkation, jtrunerbtc, kyledrake, moiety, MurphyLawn, nubbins, nubbins`i, Phinnaeus, ryepdx, and ThickAsThieves.
pankkake: ;;notes nubbins
gribble: Sent 3 weeks, 3 days, 17 hours, and 9 minutes ago: <jurov> chan clamors for -assets tshirt i recommend the disck surgery motive and Sent 2 weeks, 1 day, 23 hours, and 30 minutes ago: <bitcoinpete> i have a couple of the lealana physical coins (2x10, 2x25) but i'm having a hard time figuring out what they're worth. could you point me in the right direction?
pankkake: ;;notes nubbins`i
gribble: Sent 2 weeks, 1 day, 23 hours, and 30 minutes ago: <bitcoinpete> have a couple of the lealana physical coins (2x10, 2x25) but i'm having a hard time figuring out what they're worth. could you point me in the right direction?
nubbins`: o look
nubbins`: bitcoinpete is having a hard time figuring out a few things
nubbins`: ;;later tell bitcoinpete you're on your own with physical litecoins :(
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 10 @ 0.02033199 = 0.2033 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 10 @ 0.02021315 = 0.2021 BTC [-]
mike_c: ;;seen thickasthieves
gribble: thickasthieves was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 2 days, 15 hours, 8 minutes, and 10 seconds ago: <ThickAsThieves> raccoons are like idiot cats
mike_c: with rabies
nubbins`: and sensitive hands
fluffypony: xmj: around?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 29 @ 0.04405928 = 1.2777 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38382 @ 0.00085314 = 32.7452 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8350 @ 0.00085362 = 7.1277 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29950 @ 0.00085474 = 25.5995 BTC [+]
dignork: there is some nonsense in spoondoolies article, for example BeagleBoneBlack
pankkake: why?
dignork: it doesn't have BB, there is an ARM chip embedded on the main board
thestringpuller: fluffypony: around?
dignork: also it's funny to call a "leak" something that is published on their site in specs :)
fluffypony: well I'm trying to lose weight, but I suppose you could call me a round
Apocalyptic: <dignork> also it's funny to call a "leak" something that is published on their site in specs :) // gotta attract the audience
dignork: Apocalyptic: yep, probably it's a company PR anyway, just executed by someone clueless
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.07200201 = 0.36 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27760 @ 0.00085129 = 23.6318 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PROV] 56 @ 0.002 = 0.112 BTC {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PROV] 150 @ 0.002 = 0.3 BTC
benkay: dunno jurov, every time i go to pull up coinbr...prostitutes.
dignork: so is the http://www.coindesk.com/details-spondoolies-tech-new-bitcoin-mining-asic-leaked-online/ claiming a leak of ASIC specs - hint: they where published on bitcointalk in april
assbot: Details of New Spondoolies-Tech Bitcoin Mining ASIC Leaked Online
jurov: benkay you tend to think the siren is a whore?
benkay: no man i swear there's something weird in the dns
benkay: all i get is whores
benkay: not bitcoins
benkay: it's a mystery
jurov: O.o
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27887 @ 0.00084992 = 23.7017 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Madonna - Like a Prayer [Official Music Video] - YouTube
dignork: benkay: for me it resolves to 54.247.173.21, no whores, only siren. what am i doing wrong?
benkay: i'm just messing with you, jurov. i've never actually succeeded in piping hookers over the internet.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.07200031 = 0.216 BTC [-]
jurov: i succeeded making my boss to
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.24 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36300 @ 0.00085434 = 31.0125 BTC [+] {3}
jurov: i was explaining to him whatvV "wiki" is
jurov: he typed "viki" into google and automatically clicked first result
jurov: he got desktop changed into cunts and bookmarks and everything
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10600 @ 0.00084972 = 9.007 BTC [-]
mike_c: "i'm feeling lucky" ftw
benkay: skimpy logs. mike_c i'm taking a page out of your book and reading berkshire letters over coffee...
benkay: 3000 words, once per year. that's a pace i could sustain...
mike_c: 1965 - 76 aren't online, but the ebook is only $3.
mike_c: somebody prolly has them posted somewhere if you look around.
mike_c: all are worthwhile reading.
benkay: ebook stretches back to 1965?
mike_c: yeah
mike_c: interesting because the early years are him digging his way out of his first mistakes (buying a textile company)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 1.87444432 BTC to 8`764 shares, 21388 satoshi per share
kakobrekla: thats why its not on printed editions.
mike_c: hehe. he's actually pretty good about beating himself up.
mike_c: which is easier when you are the controlling shareholder.
assbot: Warren Buffett Letters to Partners 1959 - 1969
mike_c: interesting. those aren't the B/H letters, but those look good too.
benkay: "There are undoubtedly more mercurially-tempered people in the stock market now than for a good many years, and the duration of their stay will be limited to how long they think profits can be made quickly and effortlessly."
benkay: so those are the 'buffet partnership letters'
benkay: and not the 'berkshire hathaway letters'?
benkay: bah it pains me to give amazon money
benkay: i hate these four-hour-fuckers
mike_c: yes. buffet partnership, ltd bought B/H in 65
benkay: build a real company
benkay: i'm calling it a business expense. the business buys all sorts of stupid fiat scams all the time.
benkay: hey mike you do dev work in the states - have you ever gone in for errors and omissions insurance?
benkay: mike_c:
mike_c: i don't do contract work. i've got some other insurance covering me, D&O or something
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37445 @ 0.00084971 = 31.8174 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: BtcAlpha.com F.MPIF Tracker estimated NAV per share: 0.00021703 BTC (Total: 434.06 BTC). Last trade for F.MPIF on MPEX was at 0.00021725 BTC [+]
benkay: ;;calc 17/1.3
gribble: 13.0769230769
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9450 @ 0.00084971 = 8.0298 BTC [-]
thestringpuller: !jd mpif
assbot: Current MPIF account balance on Just-Dice: 170.47920326 BTC; -0.03277293 BTC (-0.0192%) since last check 8h 41m 3s ago.
nubbins`: dat loss
pankkake: assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PROV] 56 @ 0.002 = 0.112 BTC {3} ← this tells everything. 3 transactions for 0.1 BTC
pankkake: .foundation is a newly approved TLD
pankkake: bitcoin.foundation already taken :(
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.07200031 = 0.288 BTC [-]
mike_c: grab altcoin.foundation. it'll be priceless.
nubbins`: mario kart 8 is too easy :(
pankkake: not priceless, it costs ~20€ :p not counting the whois protections if available
fluffypony: pankkake: whilst you're checking, is dogecoin.foundation available?
fluffypony: *cue evil laugh*
pankkake: taken :(
pankkake: as well as litecoin.foundation. fuckers
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 10 @ 0.22299676 = 2.23 BTC [-] {8}
fluffypony: dammit
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 10 @ 0.22 = 2.2 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 150 @ 0.00230059 = 0.3451 BTC [-] {2}
jurov: try bitcoin.surgery
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.0734995 = 0.735 BTC [+]
nubbins`: jurov lel
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5000 @ 0.00085484 = 4.2742 BTC [+]
Mats_cd03: how do you recover data from an SSD with a failed microcontroller
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 12 @ 0.02383066 = 0.286 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34700 @ 0.00085096 = 29.5283 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21130 @ 0.00085484 = 18.0628 BTC [+]
fluffypony: Mats_cd03: you need someone that can do this with a replacement microcontroller - http://elm-chan.org/docs/wire/wiring_e.html
assbot: ELM - Extreme Wiring on the Prototyping Board
Mats_cd03: what am i looking at
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.2154 BTC [-]
fluffypony: soldering
assbot: How to Succeed With Your Bitcoin Startup
fluffypony: pankkake: have you seen the comment?
fluffypony: "Don't sell your soul to VC if you don't have to. Try community funding first.
fluffypony: I'm sure people would buy shares like crazy if you issue them as colored coins (if the idea is good)."
fluffypony: l.o.l.
pankkake: my javascript blocking rules don't show comments there
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 81 @ 0.00198856 = 0.1611 BTC [+] {4}
pankkake: "if the idea is good" oh god :(
benkay: new work shipped. http://survantjames.com/ , click "Tozny"
assbot: Survant James - Design & Engineering
benkay: mircea_popescu doesn't get to see it without js sorry boss
pankkake: "our works" works, but not clicking on tozny. I don't see why that couldn't be possible
fluffypony: benkay: nice, looks pretty
mike_c: clicking tozny worked for me
benkay: mike_c: where is this berkshire ebook?
assbot: Berkshire Hathaway Letters to Shareholders, 2012: Warren Buffett, Max Olson: 9781595910776: Amazon.com: Books
pankkake: I have an un-drmed azw3 for the interested. can be easily converted to epub
benkay: pankkake: it pops a modal. maybe one of the designers knows how to make it happen without js, but that's like 0.001% of potential clients.
benkay: dorp i didn't see the "kindle 3 dollars" button
mike_c: it moves around a lot when i click the client boxes
benkay: pankkake: i'm interested.
mike_c: why jerk up the 'our work' header?
Mats_cd03: what makes you qualified to audit cryptography
pankkake: if you buy an ebook on amazon, you hate your freedoms :)
mike_c: $3 for an ebook sounds like the right price to me.
mike_c: paying $20 for an ebook means you hate freedom (and children)
fluffypony: and puppies
pankkake: a format that works only with amazon's reader and comes with drm, that's an horrible combo
pankkake: http://wikisend.com/download/960424/ first time I use the thing, tell me if it doesn't work
assbot: Wikisend: free file sharing service
mike_c: idk, i'm not in the 'everything should be free' camp.
fluffypony: makes two of us
pankkake: I buy stuff I can own
benkay: Mats_cd03: we found the stuff as what was wrong and unfucked it.
fluffypony: xmj xmj xmj xmj xmj xmj xmj
fluffypony kicks xmj in the balls
mike_c: you can't own trilema pages. gotta rent them.
pankkake: I can save them if I want to, and it's not trying to forbid it
mike_c: that is true.
nubbins`: y'know, i think bitcoin has actually soured my opinion of the concept of an "idea"
pankkake: we need the bandcamp of ebooks: no account needed, pay and get un-drmed ebook in the format of your choice
nubbins`: well, maybe soured isn't the word
nubbins`: but i look at it a different way now
benkay: the value of the letters has already been delivered in berkshire stock appreciation
nubbins`: people say
nubbins`: "i had an idea the other day"
benkay: this ebook thing is a vehicle for this startupper to make money on others work
nubbins`: and i'm automatically uninterested
benkay: i had an idea: buy a datacenter in argentina.
pankkake: the letters are available for free, this is just a nicer packaging
nubbins`: they have data there?
nubbins`: also: they used an actual live jazz band for the music in mario kart 8
benkay: thanks pankkake seems good but haven't actually opened it yet
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.215 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PROV] 105 @ 0.002 = 0.21 BTC
mircea_popescu: FabianB on it
dignork: mircea_popescu: not a working code yet, but might be a fancy extension to multibet: https://github.com/orisi/orisi/
assbot: orisi/orisi GitHub
mircea_popescu: dignork gotta take that up with kakobrekla
mircea_popescu: im onlyhere for the cookies
dignork: *bitbet, no idea what multibet is
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.07200051 = 0.72 BTC [-]
mike_c: dignork: what is it?
dignork: o dog, i know why the term looked familiar, mircea_popescu - forum cookies: https://bitcointa.lk/threads/xcp-ipo-announcement-dunnecapital-ltd-uk-bitcoin-exchange-and-a-casino.304299/
assbot: [XCP] IPO announcement. DunneCapital LTD - UK bitcoin exchange and a casino | Bitcointa.lk
mircea_popescu: jurov: he typed "viki" << i typed viki and nothing happened
dignork: mike_c: the git thing?
mike_c: yeah
dignork: it's partial implementation of "distributed oracle"
jurov: mircea_popescu: that was 7 or so years ago, google worked as advertised then
mircea_popescu: anyway, the dunne thing, what about it dignork ? guy was briefly here about that time
dignork: so you have oracle bot that can be hacked/bribed w.e, but if you have multiple, it's assumed to be harder to do
dignork: dunne is a dev of multibet
mircea_popescu: "Second set of drafts coming through tomorrow. Seen a little preview, already looking very sharp. After that, we refine and then program. Looking good for the one month ETA"
mircea_popescu: he's also stuck in the wrong paradigm.
mircea_popescu: bitcoin isn't web"dev".
mircea_popescu: pankkake: as well as litecoin.foundation. fuckers << dude who the fuck cares.
dignork: mircea_popescu: they open sourced their current code in git, assuming free security reviews, stopped watchig after that
mircea_popescu: a decade back they introduced .ro, ie, for romania. i laughed at them then, i'm still laughi8ng at them
mircea_popescu: "o no but you must get a romania tld". why ?
mike_c: dignork: but then you trusting the crowd of oracles to make the right decision. see rota for examples of that not working so well.
mircea_popescu: fluffypony: l.o.l. << don't do something merely stupid. do something spectacularly stupid instead!!! and don't even mention the actually sane alternative, that's gonna hurt your feelings so it doesn't exist.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22119 @ 0.00085487 = 18.9089 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 10 @ 0.0236052 = 0.2361 BTC [-]
dignork: mike_c: i think it's possible to make a multisig fund, where each oracle op drops some funds, these funds are deal insurance, but I didn't think it through completely
dignork: say they'll be redemed in case of detacted fraud
mike_c: it probably has good uses, but i wouldn't like bitbets decided by a vote.
dignork: *detected
mike_c: i'm not worried about fraud, more like bad decisions.
mircea_popescu: mike_c: idk, i'm not in the 'everything should be free' camp. << but the camp is "nothing should be amazon"
pankkake: I like Amazon for delivering physical items, they do it very well
mircea_popescu: nubbins`: y'know, i think bitcoin has actually soured my opinion of the concept of an "idea" << actual business experience in the company of actual business people has soured you on infantile bullcrap. neither bitcoin nor ideas particularly involved.
punkman: I think if bitbet provided an oracle service that might be handy for building things on, but I'm not about to trust some random dude's oracle
mircea_popescu: pankkake yeah. "nothing virtual shjould be amazon"
dignork: mike_c: maybe only subset of bets, which can be automatically verified, these bets are submitted without review, less work for bitbet op, more monies for turnover
mircea_popescu: punkman oracle service cost is unbound is the problem.
punkman: mircea_popescu: why?
pankkake: what kind of bets can be automatically verified? do you trust the source not to fuck up?
pankkake: ;;ticker --avg
pankkake: just an example
mircea_popescu: why is something not something else you ask me ?
punkman: in fact bitbet already provides an oracle service for free
mircea_popescu: because it isn't ?
mircea_popescu: maybe we don't mean the same thing by oracle then
mircea_popescu: how does your definition go ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PROV] 58 @ 0.002 = 0.116 BTC
dignork: pankkake: the oracle can work like : yes/no/idunnohumanplease
punkman: not the canonical one, more in the sense of these blockchain oracle constructions
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 5 @ 0.0250013 = 0.125 BTC [+]
punkman: anyway why not charge a fee to sign transactions when X bet resolves
punkman: if there's interest, you can also provide answers to things that aren't worth betting on
mircea_popescu: what's that help ?
mircea_popescu: that's ok, question that aren';t worth betting on aren't worth answering.
mircea_popescu: and anyone can trivially be charged a fee for finding out when x bet resolves : he sends a bet to a virgin address
mircea_popescu: when btc makes it to that address the bet resolved.
punkman: ;;later tell mircea_popescu a silly example, me and dignork both make a 1btc transaction to each other, but we can only spend them after the bitbet oracle signs the transaction
gribble: The operation succeeded.
punkman: this is not a new idea, this was an early implementation https://earlytemple.com:8181/
assbot: Early Temple
punkman: what I'm describing is more like escrow than oracle I guess
mircea_popescu: punkman maybe if you explained the usecase ?
punkman: I did a later tell
mircea_popescu: i got it. that's not really a usecase th
Namworld: So where was I in my half-asleep/half-daydreaming hypothetical nonsense scenarios?
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 462 @ 0.00206048 = 0.9519 BTC [+]
assbot: Log In - The New York Times
fluffypony: even assbot is paywall'd
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PROV] 98 @ 0.002 = 0.196 BTC
Namworld: Hmm, another Havelock IPO...
benkay: "disliking the usg makes you a bad person"
Namworld: "Our 28nm ASIC design architecture dubbed the “Creator” to be used at the foundry level allows for simultaneous production of the 1TH “Creator 1” Bitcoin ASIC, 256GH “Creator 2” Bitcoin ASIC and the 4MH “Creator 3” SCRYPT ASIC from the same wafer batch. This unique ability, and the lower costs associated with the FDSOI process, lends Provenance ASIC a competitive advantage
Namworld: with regards to $/GH/W and unparalleled ASIC diversification with essentially three different ASIC products available from one production batch."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7491 @ 0.00085491 = 6.4041 BTC [+]
Namworld: Anyone that knows about the ASIC design process, how non-sensical is that statement?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 15 @ 0.025001 = 0.375 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.07200021 = 0.216 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: Namworld: not entirely nonsensical. see the story of the intel 486 dx - and many subsequent chips
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43400 @ 0.00085517 = 37.1144 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: Namworld not bad, on paper.
thestringpuller: In bitcoin: "A scam until proven innocent by a court of #bitcoin-assets"
mircea_popescu: course so far that's correlated moreover negatively over the history of bitcoin miner manufacturers
Namworld: So sale pitches are improving in quality.
mircea_popescu: nevertheless, it's unclear to me what exact benefit would this be. if you can make 1 th asics, you can sell 1 th asics.
mircea_popescu: if you can make 1/4 th, you can idem sell those.
mircea_popescu: the advantage of making both "in the same batch" is quite unclear, not like you'd be stuck with batches of like, 3 full and 7 1/4s
mircea_popescu: as large as your batch can conceivably be, you'll sell it, either full or quarter.
mircea_popescu: !up hdbuck
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: advantage of making both in same batch -> you do it whether you want to or not. process yield.
mircea_popescu: at any rate, silicon on insulator, and especially on 28nm, is ANYTHING but low cost.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.072998 = 0.219 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform that too.
mircea_popescu: Namworld anyway, ask them if they use saphire or not. the answer will be informative.
Namworld: Eheheh, I was looking at that part on wikipedia, reading up on FDSOI. Wondering what's the point of it if it's an expensive process.
hdbuck: mircea_popescu hello MP, thx for the voice up, i came here with the hope you could help me apprehend that blockchain size issue (& considering it is an issue). been reading tons of articles about that and people talks about 'industrial' supernodes and/or 'restructuring' Bitcoin.. cant make up my mind whether thats good or bad tho. any inputs? :)
Namworld: Seems it has uses in compact electronics. For Bitcoin mining, you don't need compact performance, space is cheap.
Namworld: Ah, I see the part about Sapphire. The answer would be informative indeed.
benkay: hdbuck: if you can't afford the space to store the blockchain, what are you doing in btc anyways?
benkay: hdbuck: there's also SPV, but I'm not entirely certain how that actually works.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 13 @ 0.07176763 = 0.933 BTC [-] {2}
hdbuck: benkay its not my personnal storing that i am concerned with. i am just wondering if this issue wont harm bitcoin on the long run.
Namworld: The blockchain ain't all that big yet...
hdbuck: saw pretty pessimistic articles about that matter regarding the long run of Bitcoin. plus those core devs seem not to have a clue about what's going to happen - so i figured.. you guys should know better! ^^
diametric: I have to admit, its annoying getting a fresh copy of the blockchain in a new client, even though I have the space, and I have 75Mbit internet, it still takes over 2 days.
benkay: hdbuck: how can you hurt bitcoin?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47100 @ 0.00085606 = 40.3204 BTC [+] {2}
diametric: though I've never tried any of the bootstrap methods
benkay: it simply exists.
benkay: blockchain monotonically increases in size. this is a fact of reality.
Namworld: Well assuming storage capacity keeps increasing at current rate, and that population growth is doubling much less often than computing capacity...
hdbuck: benkay : well, some argue that the more the blochain size increase, the less people would actually download it to use bitcoins. other also argue that it would give more power to supernodes, centralising bitcoin, which was something that bitcoin was suppose to oppose. or is it just the NSA and co that will run Bitcoin once it get too big? ^^
Namworld: It might be a problem for a short while. Assuming we reach saturation of usage, it might grow almost linearly, at least compared to storage capacity growth. Even if population growth and associated usage is exponential, the exponent is much lower than storage growth.
benkay: <hdbuck> benkay : well, some argue that the more the blochain size increase, the less people would actually download it to use bitcoins // you're conflating "fewer people using btc" with "bad for btc". this has yet to be established.
Namworld: I'm somewhat expecting the blockchain size to eventually become negligible.
Namworld: The thing is current adoption rate is increasing much faster than storage capacity, so it's catching up and becoming large in today's standards.
hdbuck: benkay: ah i know you guys think of it as gold 2.0 which is not meant for the average joe to come around with but i am just not sure how this will all play out. :/
benkay: hdbuck: are you ignoring the SPV thing?
benkay: you don't need a blockchain to accept/send btc.
benkay: ;;gettrust hdbuck
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user benkay to user hdbuck: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=benkay&dest=hdbuck | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=hdbuck | Rated since: never
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16800 @ 0.00085655 = 14.39 BTC [+] {2}
Namworld: Blockchain is 18GB. It was 8 last year. We currently have not too expensive disk 4000GB hard disks.
benkay: i imagine you're just a random joe not in the web of trust, hdbuck ?
Namworld: We will probably reach usage saturation and blockchain will grow too slowly compared to storage doubling in capacity much before blockchain doesn't fit in a single recent consumer grade drive.
benkay: some day you'll need an entire DC for the blockchain. what of it?
Namworld: Yeah blockchain is big. But storage capacity and computing power is increasing very rapidely and exponentially. Much faster the the amount of worldwide transactions.
Namworld: than the*
Namworld: benkay, you would eventually need an entire DC assuming computer components stopped improving every year.
BingoBoingo: benkay: Nah, storage capacities are growing too fast and have too much of a head start. It will probably fit on a single hard drive for at least another decade. It's just... Parsing the block chain as a full node will probably require more thoroughput than a single drive offers.
hdbuck: benkay: ahah yes probably. im some humble average joe not very used to that WOT thing sry.. trying to learn tho ^^
asciilifeform: wonder if anyone else has toyed with the idea of hardware purpose-built to store blockchain. think ssd, but write-only (antifuse! etc)
benkay: !up hdbuck
benkay: hdbuck: if you're serious about wanting to learn, start with gpg. get into the wot, get a rating, lurk or derp in here as you see fit.
asciilifeform: standardize calendar sync. and snippet length - so if you own one, you will always know if it works - compare to another one for same time period
benkay: no crime in being wrong, i do it all the time. there's plenty of larnin' to go around.
Namworld: I expect it to go like this -> adoption keeps going up fast, blockchain grows faster and faster, people get worried, we reach saturation of usage, blockchain growth starts looking linear, storage capacity keeps doubling every few years, people stop worrying.
Mats_cd03: seems like this is a solved problem with SPV
benkay: i'm highlighting that in a worst case scenario it's not a problem and also as Mats_cd03 and i have and keep pointing out - not a problem to begin with even.
Namworld: Blockchain keeps fitting on a single drive as long as it's regularly upgraded to a recent one and start looking smaller and smaller.
benkay: ('cause SPV).
asciilifeform: storing bits that never need to flip again ought to be technologically simpler - on basic physical level - than the normal kind.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I've put some though into it.
hdbuck: benkay: alright, thanks man - i'll check MP's guide. :)
benkay: failing that, you can use a btc addr as well.
asciilifeform: one basic function in such a gadget is that it ought to be able to compare itself, via direct electrical wiring, to another one purporting to be identical.
Mats_cd03: it seems like the world desperately needs a well documented SPV client
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49450 @ 0.00085709 = 42.3831 BTC [+] {3}
BingoBoingo: Mats_cd03: Good place to start would be forking an older version of Multibit and BitcoinJ watching out for slop
Mats_cd03: i like where the project bit-c is right now
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 7 @ 0.0184074 = 0.1289 BTC [-]
Namworld: What's bit-c?
BingoBoingo: http://www.forbes.com/sites/perianneboring/2014/06/09/the-boring-bitcoin-report-june-9/ Ms Boring forgot to make the distinction between the two Erik ventures
assbot: The Boring Bitcoin Report: June 9 - Forbes
BingoBoingo: Mats_cd03: Bit-c looks like it is headed somewhere nice, but it's useful to compare how all of these things are approaching the SPV problem
benkay: ;;later tell bitcoingirl honey you gotta do better than that. voorhees got in trouble for feedzebirds and not satoshidice - mostly 'cause DICE was listed on the SRO MPEx.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
Namworld: If he got in trouble for dice, the settlement would have been much larger.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30421 @ 0.00085494 = 26.0081 BTC [-]
Mats_cd03: i'm slowly adding features to it
Mats_cd03: will commit when ready
Mats_cd03: er, i guess its push instead of commit
benkay: no get it right you issue a "pull request"
benkay: sheesh
benkay: and it's not git it's gitHUB
thestringpuller: WHOA WHOA WHOA
jurov: benkay i pointed her to bingo§s article, and later told that explicitly, looks like she could not be helped
thestringpuller: mah nigga
thestringpuller: smickles !!!!!!!!
smickles: ME!!!!!!!
thestringpuller: the little one must be walking by now
smickles: indeed
thestringpuller: haha. my how time flies
smickles: and climbing
smickles: I have taken over the bitcoin corp in eve
assbot: Last 1 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/0PXEZYD.txt )
benkay: !b 1
smickles: lol, what did that do benkay ?
assbot: #bitcoin-assets bash
smickles: so my statement about 1Bitcoin is noteworthy :)
TomServo: Was this a hostile takeover? :D
jurov: you have the time for eve???
smickles: It was not so fun as a hostile takeover
Mats_cd03: have you pillaged all of the space ships and raped all of the women
smickles: I have found time for the less attention intensive aspects of the game
smickles: there isn't really a woman raping game mechanic
smickles: I could buy exotic dancers or prostitutes and jetison them into space.
assbot: #bitcoin-assets bash
smickles: that's about as close as it gets
Namworld: @smickles hahaha
benkay: !up ninjashogun
benkay: look who i found
benkay: or found me, i guess
BingoBoingo: Oh noes!!!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.2349997 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 27 @ 0.02599959 = 0.702 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31028 @ 0.00085628 = 26.5687 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 10 @ 0.02599989 = 0.26 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.072998 = 0.511 BTC [+]
bitstein: The appcoin fraudsters attempt to defend themselves: http://letstalkbitcoin.com/blog/post/the-value-of-app-coins
assbot: The Value of App Coins | Lets Talk Bitcoin
assbot: ‘Rape culture wins’: Feminist freakout after Miss Nevada dares suggest self defense training for women | Twitchy
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.2349997 = 0.705 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.072998 = 0.511 BTC [+]
smickles: i don't think i've knowingly encountered a society of rapists
ThickAsThieves: oh, but those times you weren't aware!
princessnell: feminists have again come full circle: attacking a beauty queen for insuffiently supporting patriarchy
ThickAsThieves: where does one learn to rape?
ThickAsThieves: because they really need to stop teaching it
fluffypony: ThickAsThieves: agreed
fluffypony: they should shut down Rape Schools across the country
fluffypony: and fire those Rape Teachers
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PROV] 220 @ 0.002 = 0.44 BTC
dub: princessnell: wat
atcbot: 40k@278 28k@277 2k@270 | 4k@144 50k@143 175k@142
princessnell: dub saying "men are responsible for women's safety" is a patriarchal notion
dub: so one half of our sepcies should require additional training to protect its ass from the other half?
princessnell: are you asking me my opinion?
dub: no need
dub: women dont need to rely on men not to be rapists!
mircea_popescu: dude 32 gb ram is pretty cool
mircea_popescu: hdbuck what you mean specifically ?
mircea_popescu: !up hdbuck
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50474 @ 0.00085762 = 43.2875 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: how goes nellie ?
princessnell: good! just finished an article for tomorrow. how are you? still on your rainbow tour?
mircea_popescu: diametric: I have to admit, its annoying getting a fresh copy of the blockchain in a new client, even though I have the space, and I have 75Mbit internet, it still takes over 2 days. << i keep a master copy like the holy fucking scriptures. which is what it is anyway
mircea_popescu: princessnell nah, settled down.
diametric: mircea_popescu: thats probably a good idea to start doing. perhaps keep it on a usb stick on my keys or something, gets updated when i plug it in.
mircea_popescu: hdbuck: benkay : well, some argue that the more the blochain size increase, the less people would actually download it to use bitcoins. other also argue that it would give more power to supernodes, centralising bitcoin, which was something that bitcoin was suppose to oppose. >> bitcoin was never intended for "people" in the sense of reddit derps, and bitcoin was never intended to oppose centralism. it was intended to
mircea_popescu: oppose the ~wrong~ sort of centralism, ie, centralism in the hands of the more or less representative, more or less elected representatives of "people" as in, reddit derps.
mircea_popescu: instead, bitcoin favours centralism in the hands of unelected and unaccountable, unrepresentative lords.
hdbuck: mircea_popescu hey man, hum its just i was kinda concerned with supernodes and the people that will run them once the BC's size would be too big for the average person to handle.
mircea_popescu: as the world and everything else was meant to work in the first place.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: one day, people will encode checkpoint hashes of blockchain as human poetry.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform likely.
bitstein: "Centralization" is a vapid term without a sound theory of monopoly and competition.
princessnell: mircea_popescu right vs wrong centralism is what my article tomorrow is about. but as you know i am a gentle touch.
hdbuck: mircea_popescu i get your point, but i aint seing Bitcoin being rightfully centralised ATM.
princessnell: hbduck look around!
mircea_popescu: princessnell we can't all bne assholes
mircea_popescu: hdbuck well what makes you think you have any sort of a vantage point ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 23 @ 0.02500104 = 0.575 BTC [-] {3}
mircea_popescu: Namworld says " Assuming we reach saturation of usage", I read " Assuming we reach saturation of usagi" and i'm all like "wtf is he on about, i'm all saturated"
hdbuck: mircea_popescu hum i dont, just wondering here and there.. looking for answers :)
mircea_popescu: benkay: you don't need a blockchain to accept/send btc. << not to mention the coinbr thing. he really doesn't need the blockchain at all.
mircea_popescu: hdbuck dun take it too personally.
Namworld: What the hell? That's one hell of a misread.
mircea_popescu: diametric> mircea_popescu: thats probably a good idea to start doing. perhaps keep it on a usb stick on my keys or something, gets updated when i plug it in. << or on a 4 redundant raid array, under concrete.
mircea_popescu: just one letter, nimworld :D
diametric: just talking about the blockchain, not my keys.
smickles: oh my, is usagi still a thing?
mircea_popescu: diametric yea i know.
Namworld: Not as in far off, but as in really weird result.
mircea_popescu: it's the fucking scriptures you understand, if we all manage to lose the chain at the same time we're fucked.
hdbuck: mircea_popescu im not taking anything personnally, i really appreciate your inputs man.. the average propaganda almost got me with their Carebears and unicorns. i'd rather being insulted for my stupidity than thrown a lollipop in my mouth ^^
mircea_popescu: a sugar frosted shittypop
asciilifeform: to deliberately torment the btc-is-eeekvality crowd: WORM storage gizmo suggested as gedankenexperiment earlier could easily accept updates signed with hardcoded key from liege-lord
mircea_popescu: smickles definitely.
mircea_popescu: where was that link to recent derpage again...
mircea_popescu: gib it to me fluffypony
fluffypony: which derpage?
smickles: even if all but a few lost the chain, i would be very suspicious of that few
assbot: BMF has lost access to it's wallet [UnModerated]
fluffypony: smickles: make sure you watch the video
mircea_popescu: fluffypony you gibt it to me in the past :D
fluffypony gives it to mircea_popescu all night long
asciilifeform: if all but a few lost the chain << no problem if we have... singable checkpoint hashes.
mircea_popescu: i guess i kinda walked right into that big cock...
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform zooko triangle issue tho
mircea_popescu: if they're singable they're prolly preimageable too
smickles: giving a thread title with [UnModerated] in it is like telling someone they are free
mircea_popescu: benkay: i'm highlighting that in a worst case scenario it's not a problem and also as Mats_cd03 and i have and keep pointing out - not a problem to begin with even. << what happens to you once gb blocks ?
asciilifeform: how many times i see zooko triangle brought up as if it were physical law.
mircea_popescu: smickles he had a moderated one
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i fear it is.
mircea_popescu: moar like riemann hypothesis.
assbot: BMF has lost access to its wallet
fluffypony: moderated thread
assbot: BMF has lost access to it's wallet | Bitcointa.lk
fluffypony: including deleted threads
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: if i recall - szabo disagreed
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: storing bits that never need to flip again ought to be technologically simpler - on basic physical level - than the normal kind. << this is a good point, and i imagine within the decade we will have special blockchain ssds being made.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.235 BTC [+]
nubbins`: re: pgp keysigning party
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: just gotta bring back antifuse. it doesnt really get much simpler than antifuse.
nubbins`: PGP WoT...?
mircea_popescu: nubbins` yes
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yes
nubbins`: of what use is this wot!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.235 BTC [+]
fluffypony: nubbins`: it's a Web of PGP Signing Parties
nubbins`: no, i get what a WoT is
pankkake: f2fs would be a good candidate for blockchain storage. anyway, I'm in the "block size won't go up that much, things will happen offchain" camp
nubbins`: just wondering what possible benefit could be gained by being represented in the "pgp wot" mentioned in article
mircea_popescu: nubbins` it strengthens the quality of debian's signatures for instance.
nubbins`: i see
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i do confess that at one point i toyed with the idea of rom-like storage on consumer 35 (or 16)mm film.
pankkake: so you know you have the right sig. prevents mitm, because it's hard to mitm real life
mike_c: pankkake: once we all sign up for circle we won't need the blockchain.
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo: Ms Boring forgot to make the distinction between the two Erik ventures << yeah not particularly inspiring.
pankkake: eheh
pankkake: s/right sig/right key/
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: film lasts a good while, easy to copy and compare via low tech means
mircea_popescu: nubbins` it's more one of those "let's inject some power into otherwise worthy projects geeks had been dilligently holding afloat with a cuttingboard and a spatula over 30 years"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform film lasts much less than you imagine.
smickles: I'm failing to see the value in this usagi crap and i didn't notice a video. I'm going to clean some dishes, easily worth more than reading about usagi
mircea_popescu: if you mean silver coloidal, it's utter shit. read up some time on the trouble hollywood has archiving, what itcosts,
mircea_popescu: how many were destroyed just to get rid of them
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41492 @ 0.00085668 = 35.5454 BTC [-] {2}
nubbins`: film gets very unstable with time too
mircea_popescu: smickles wellyou asked. the value is lulz
nubbins`: great way to burn a house down
mircea_popescu: nubbins` that's the old nitro stuff. modern film no lonmger has the problem
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: yes, it decays. but this is why the young apprentice must copy film he inherits, etc. [insert post-apocalyptic hypotheticals]
nubbins`: ahhhh
nubbins`: grandfather was a war photographer, he lost boxes of negs
mircea_popescu: nubbins` i know people who go into seizures just fgrom the smell
nubbins`: yipes
asciilifeform: just skip the nitrocellulose, none of this problem then
mircea_popescu: (there's this very distinctive vinegary scent of "o shit we just lost this warehousefull")
mircea_popescu: sorta like the smell of "we burned down 5000 hard drives. hopefully ALL th customers kept good backups
mircea_popescu: tech eyes just glaze over and stress vomiting ensues.
mircea_popescu: !up terp_
terp_: hey whats up all
asciilifeform: very few things store as much (relatively) high fidelity data, and are at the same time as easy to duplicate, as film.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform actually a cd stores more/better, but
mircea_popescu: there were some people looking into crystal doping storage
nubbins`: but bit rot isn't always noticeable until too late
mircea_popescu: seemed insanely info-dense
nubbins`: and while a few speckles on a microfiche aren't a problem, a few speckles on a dvd are
mircea_popescu: one write only, of course.
mircea_popescu: nubbins` well if you've microstored the blockchain, they are, yes.
nubbins`: a ha!
mthreat: http://aws.amazon.com/glacier/ claims "average annual durability of 99.999999999%"
assbot: AWS | Amazon Glacier - Online Backup Services & Cloud Backup Solutions
asciilifeform: error coding is a trivial problem - to any desired degree of redundancy
mthreat: $0.01 per GB-month (although retrieval apparently is more expensive)
mircea_popescu: mthreat i don't recall, what's theirtotal data store ? yotabytes ?
asciilifeform: if you want something your grandchildren might be able to copy, even if they cannot read - chemical photography. - that, or ink...
mthreat: no idea, without googling
mthreat: bigger than the blockchain
mircea_popescu: smickles: I have taken over the bitcoin corp in eve << how much shit was in the hangars in the end ?
mircea_popescu: mthreat well that for sure lol. fucking trilema is bigger than the blockchain
mircea_popescu: the melanogaster genome is bigger than the blockchain
mircea_popescu: the average redditor's porn stash is bigger than the blockchain
nubbins`: these nuts are bigger than the blockchain
mircea_popescu: i could keep going
fluffypony: someone should tell usagi about that service
mircea_popescu: the nutpacking service ?
pankkake: glacier is basically powered down hard drives. cheaper if you don't mind the high latency
mircea_popescu: so am i right in assuming the only career worthy of a man named brandon billings is... bill collection ?
Namworld: Well, it's always nice when you see someone with a last name befitting their career, at least.
mircea_popescu: princessnell: feminists have again come full circle: attacking a beauty queen for insuffiently supporting patriarchy << they're spinnin' so fast they could be weaving wool.
mircea_popescu: dub: so one half of our sepcies should require additional training to protect its ass from the other half? << yes.
mircea_popescu: in general, whenever one wants to deal with the world on one's own terms, one's required to take aditional training, and ALSO be talented.
mircea_popescu: otherwise, one can just learn to enjoy the process.
chetty: <mircea_popescu> dub: so one half of our sepcies should require additional training to protect its ass from the other half? << yes.// I doubt it works out to halves
mircea_popescu: this has nothing to do with women. when i don't want to be treated like a fucking retarded tourist and charged 2 to 5 x everything, i learn and use the fucking local language.
mircea_popescu: when i don't want to be shocked by the mains power, i learn which bits to put my hands on.
mircea_popescu: when i want to make tea rather than coffee, i acquire the skill of putting the righjt fucking thing in the pot.
mircea_popescu: it has exactly zero to do with women specifically, and the whiny pretense to the contrary has only one indicaiton :
asciilifeform: learn which bits to put my hands on << i find this - in essence - to be the most handy test of who is worth dealing with as human vs meat
asciilifeform: ;;google the camel has two humps
gribble: The camel has two humps (working title) - tof: <http://wiki.t-o-f.info/uploads/EDM4600/The%20camel%20has%20two%20humps.pdf>; The camel has two humps (working title) - University of Kent: <https://www.cs.kent.ac.uk/dept_info/seminars/2005_06/paper1.pdf>; Alan Kay on 'The Camel has Two Humps' - secretGeek: <http://secretgeek.net/camel_kay.asp>
mike_c: related aside: i got charged 2 to 3x for everything in romania and still felt like i was getting a deal
mircea_popescu: mike_c were you ? like what ?
mike_c: like at local convience store at 3am
mircea_popescu: yeabut i mean what you buy and what'd you pay
mike_c: hmm.. what i paid would tax the memory. but just like drinks and stuff.
mircea_popescu: was kinda curious what the actual factor was :p
jurov: http://ronja.twibright.com/optar/ can store 200kB/page..means 100k pages for today's blockchain
assbot: Twibright Optar
mike_c: but i distinctly remember comparing what i got charged to some of the posted prices in the store and realizing (and not minding) that he was bending me over.
mircea_popescu: a ok then lol
mircea_popescu: you should see the prices here.
mircea_popescu: carton of ciggaretes ? $19
mircea_popescu: and actually good camels, as opposed to the fire-retardant, chemical blend crap they sell in the us/eu to justify the theory that smoking causes cancer
mike_c: taste decent? i know this guy that gets dirt cheap smokes in canada and they taste like you're smoking somebody else's cigarette after they were done with it.
mthreat: taxis in buenos aires are often cheaper than a bus ride in the US
mircea_popescu: smoking TOBACCO doesn't do you in quite as drastically as smoking contemporary ciggaretts
BingoBoingo: I wonder if sfter death my lungs will find themselves better preserved than my bones
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37050 @ 0.00085486 = 31.6726 BTC [-] {2}
jurov: lol they will find lung and liver fossilies, bones long gone?
BingoBoingo: I wish I could know the answer to that
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4800 @ 0.00085445 = 4.1014 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: Home
benkay: <mircea_popescu> benkay: you don't need a blockchain to accept/send btc. << not to mention the coinbr thing. he really doesn't need the blockchain at all. // coinbr requires btc addr to sign up i b'leev
jurov: btc signatures don't need blockchain either
benkay: <mircea_popescu> benkay: i'm highlighting that in a worst case scenario it's not a problem and also as Mats_cd03 and i have and keep pointing out - not a problem to begin with even. << what happens to you once gb blocks ? // let me know when it's realistic.
jurov: it's not like everything must be stuffed into btc blockchain, we already have altcoins
diametric: whatever happened with that side chains circlejerk that was going around not long ago?
assbot: Police release details of murderous Las Vegas rampage
BingoBoingo: diametric: The people who supposed them and the people capable of making them were not the same groups of people I imagine.
mike_c: "Wilcox walked past Amanda Miller and confronted her husband. Amanda Miller then fatally shot Wilcox"
jurov: ARCHAEOLOGISTS RECOVERED FABLED GENESIS BLOCK FROM GLASS DISC ACCOMPANIED BY LIVER ABD LUNG FOSSILS
asciilifeform: ;;google crank bait orlov
gribble: ClubOrlov: The Rationale behind the Boston Psy-ops: <http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2013/04/the-rationale-behind-boston-psy-ops.html>; JOURNAL: Dmitry Orlov on Collapse - Global Guerrillas: <http://globalguerrillas.typepad.com/globalguerrillas/2010/11/journal-dmitry-orlov-on-collapse.html>; Mario's Fresh Bait - Geelong, VIC - Shopping & Retail | Facebook: (1 more message)
BingoBoingo: You know what would be the interesting desk accessory for bitcoiners, a Lucite genesis block, block. For use as a paperweight or bludgeon or whatever.
benkay: yup. want it.
benkay: but embedded in a sceptre
benkay: and probably made of something hard and valuable.
benkay: maybe even poky.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 5000 @ 0.00005495 = 0.2748 BTC [+] {2}
jurov: sceptre? didn't know you're so theatrically inclined
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2319 @ 0.00005499 = 0.1275 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 100 @ 0.00206055 = 0.2061 BTC [+]
Mats_cd03: benkay is a queen
Mats_cd03: har har
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3200 @ 0.00085554 = 2.7377 BTC [+]
jurov: or a goat
benkay: or a SUPERNODDDDDDDE
benkay: in a sauna.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18848 @ 0.00085622 = 16.138 BTC [+]
cazalla: nubbins`: too easy against cpu or online play? i've got to buy a pro wii controller as the gamepad gives me rsi with mk8
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16902 @ 0.00085622 = 14.4718 BTC [+]
nubbins` sighs
nubbins`: i just dented the floor with my keys :/
benkay: ;;ident gabriela
gribble: Error: I am not seeing this user on IRC. If you want information about a registered gpg user, try the 'gpg info' command instead.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11400 @ 0.00085622 = 9.7609 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9948 @ 0.00085745 = 8.5299 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42800 @ 0.00085766 = 36.7078 BTC [+] {2}
thestringpuller: !ticker m F.MPIF
assbot: [MPEX:F.MPIF] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 0.00021548 / 0.00021603 / 0.00021725 (14601 shares, 3.15 BTC), 30D: 0.00021536 / 0.00021709 / 0.00021726 (124310 shares, 26.99 BTC)
thestringpuller: moopmoop
mike_c: lol. this site wants to make sure i am using: Mozilla® Firefox® 10, 11, 12, 13, 15, 19 or 25
pankkake: so only insecure unmainted versions?!
mike_c: that v14 must have been a killer
asciilifeform: cryptome dead?
pankkake: 24's still supported, 25 isn't
mike_c: nice
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11150 @ 0.00085745 = 9.5606 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: That's unsettleing
thestringpuller: 24's rollin' dubs
asciilifeform: speaking of the blockchain storage discussion from earlier - anyone remember 'ArVid' ?
asciilifeform: ;;google ArVid backup
gribble: ArVid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ArVid>; Using Video Recorders for Backup - Stuart Cheshire: <http://stuartcheshire.org/rants/VideoBackup.html>; Arvid Gerstmann - Android Apps on Google Play: <https://play.google.com/store/apps/developer?id=Arvid+Gerstmann>
asciilifeform: current blockchain would easily fit on ~10 vhs tapes.
asciilifeform: blockchain is more or less an ideal application for tape (and any other non-randomaccess medium)
mike_c: yeah, there you go. classic storage device for non-flippin bits.
mike_c: tape backup drives are reasonably fast too.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PROV] 100 @ 0.002 = 0.2 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 7 @ 0.0241769 = 0.1692 BTC [+]
fluffypony: the NYPD commissioner looks like he'll eat your children for breakfast
assbot: The NYPD Still Won't Explain Its Drone Plans | Motherboard
benkay: bitbiz: ship blockchains on hdd's
mike_c: tapes are $20 / TB. can't beat that with a stick.
mike_c: william bratton?
mike_c: he doesn't look half as scary as ray kelly did.
mike_c: broken windows my ass
dub wont mention what he's been doing this morning
assbot: The Drone That Will Change Graffiti: An Interview with KATSU | Motherboard
asciilifeform: ^ robotic graffiti isn't new; i vaguely recall a 'printer van' with eight spray cans that spat out text as it went, circa '04
dub: I recall seeing a paintball dot matrix printer in some promo
asciilifeform: one might imagine that eventually graffiti folks will play 'paintball' with supposedly-unpaintable symbols of usg dominance
asciilifeform pictures the inevitable solar-powered automatic vandalizer controlled via blockchain...
asciilifeform: works best with the (hypothetical) north korean blockchain shortwave repeater.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41900 @ 0.00085781 = 35.9422 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: mike_c yeah, they taste like the 80s
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34700 @ 0.00085631 = 29.714 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: jurov: lol they will find lung and liver fossilies, bones long gone? << this is likely lol
benkay: asciilifeform, dub: almost needless to point out by now, but the buenos aires public wall paintings are better than anything the NYC scene has cranked out since...forever.
benkay: "everything is better in argentinga"
benkay: *argentina
benkay: gold tongue!
benkay: no wait silvertongue
asciilifeform: ;;google argentina sparkletina
gribble: sparkletina - Yahoo Answers: <https://answers.yahoo.com/activity?show=KWGBHWRCDPYNIHJ42B5LQ3VGI4&t=g>; I need help creating a livingroom with a masculine flair like an ...: <https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20061028054928AACOmEw>
mircea_popescu: btw, "coinbr requires btc addr to sign up i b'leev" << so what if it does ? once you're in you can trade with anyone else in.
benkay: yeah, jurov pointed out that it's not actually dependent on the bc
benkay: although i haven't found the signing functionality in bitc yet - mebbe Mats_cd03 makes that happen
mircea_popescu: <benkay> asciilifeform, dub: almost needless to point out by now, but the buenos aires public wall paintings are better than anything the NYC scene has cranked out since...forever. << this is true.
mircea_popescu: and women actually paint walls here, which is refreshing.
mircea_popescu: the us "scene" is like greenspun's ciclid association. all dorks.
benkay: the negros were pretty hxc back in the day, non?
mircea_popescu: but women ?
asciilifeform: 'sparkletina' is apparently a 'key word' used by various u.s. (?) folks who wish they could move there
mircea_popescu: benkay " let me know when it's realistic." << let me explain realistic. if there's 4k txn a second, which weigh a conservative 512 bytes each, at 512 seconds per block you get...
asciilifeform: (google fails again)
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 512 * 512 * 4000
gribble: 1048576000
mircea_popescu: surprise surprise, our friend mr 1gb block.
mircea_popescu: now, 4k txn / second is nothing if you srsly aspire to be visa.
benkay: so this implies a rather hard fork.
asciilifeform: i thought blockchain only aspires to be 'good delivery brick' vs. visa
benkay: and weren't you just harping on the upsides to a size-constrained block? more competition for limited resources?
mircea_popescu: it just implies "accessibility" is about as dumb a thing to think about re bitcoin as you know, speeding tickets for snails.
asciilifeform: betcha they'd invent speeding ticket if they could.
mircea_popescu: we really don't want, need or could use more poorfags/stupidfags involved
asciilifeform: 'yer doing 5mm/sec in a 4mm zone'
mircea_popescu: admitting against all evidence that there even exists a distinmction between stupid and poor.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform lol.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 61500 @ 0.00085705 = 52.7086 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: so i just did a round of solid shopping.
mircea_popescu: gonna paste the list in here, anyone's welcome to guess either us, romania or buenos aires prices for the lot
mircea_popescu: then in an hour or so i tell teh truth.
mircea_popescu: here goes :
mircea_popescu: lb ground beef, 2lb nice beef steak, 6lb fresh ripe pineaple, half lb fresh figs, lb plums,1.5lb masdaam, swiss, smoked local cheese, lb cold cuts/fungs sausage,lb spinach, salad, 2lb ripe tomatoes, 1/2lb mushrooms, lb red peppers,4 ears young corn,2 artichokes,100g dry shitake,100g maraschino cherries, lb chickpeas,14oz heinz ketchup, half lb exceptionally grandiose aceitunas verdes, imported dijon 210g, cabfare 15kms
mircea_popescu: round trip.
asciilifeform: ~300 usd (if bought here.)
asciilifeform: ~400 if you want actual (vs. synthetic) foods.
mircea_popescu: o it's all actual
mircea_popescu: you should see this pineaple.
mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03: benkay is a queen << ahahaha they got yo numba nao vulpes.
Namworld: 300 USD? Sounds a bit too high. Even for Canada/US
mircea_popescu: mike_c: tapes are $20 / TB. can't beat that with a stick. << quite true.
mike_c: i could only guess at the cab ride. i'm a better cook than benkay but that's about it.
mircea_popescu: the blockchain is a bettercook than benkay
Namworld: Well 15km would be what, around 30 USD? Round-trip, 60USD?
mircea_popescu: no, 15km is the whole round trip. market is like 5ish miles away
mthreat: cab fare around 150 pesos, unless stuck in lots of traffic
mircea_popescu: this nice, farmer's market thing
mircea_popescu: mthreat you prolly know progreso
mthreat: not by name.. where's that one?
mircea_popescu: ;;google Mercado del Progreso
gribble: Mercado del Progreso | WhatsUpBuenosAires: <http://www.whatsupbuenosaires.com/news/Mercado_del_Progreso>; Mercado del Progreso – Buenos Aires, Argentina | publicmarkets.com: <http://publicmarkets.com/mercado-del-progreso/>; Caballito, Buenos Aires - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caballito,_Buenos_Aires>
Namworld: ok, then... I'd put cost closer to 150-180 USD then...
mircea_popescu: Namworld where that, in quebec ?
asciilifeform: ignoring the question of whether these things ('as printed on the crate', rather than doctored substitutes) can even be had in usa.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform well, the heinz is a direct import.
mircea_popescu: worchestershire (known here as "salsa inglesa") they were out of
Namworld: Well yes, I suppose. Canada/US should have similar prices all around. Although certain products will vary by region.
mircea_popescu: the notion that the us has the same prices all around boggles my mind.
mircea_popescu: all around kansas orwhat ?!
mircea_popescu: "This white paper seeks to put forth the economic and technical reasons that the digital tokens known as “AppCoins” can develop a value in the market and maintain their value over the long term, should their associated application gain adoption by users. "
mircea_popescu: summary "hello i would like to be indicted"
Namworld: They don't, but assuming a large amount of varied goods, probably rarely more difference than 10%-15% for the same stuff.
Namworld: Barring shopping at a place with higher quality products. The outlets would need to be similar in both place.
mircea_popescu: i guess you've never lived in san diego, manhattan, downtown dc etc.
mircea_popescu: but this is the highest quality products baby :)
mircea_popescu: the outlets can't be similar, because podunk doesn't have jewish delis.
thestringpuller: on data Andrew Auernheimer
Namworld: Hmm, I guess I should consider that. Downtown locations will be more expensive...
mircea_popescu: and speaking of jewish deli, you should have seen this butcher get the steak off the bone.
mircea_popescu: an artist, this man.
mircea_popescu: at it for 39 years, he said when asked. "and after that long time, you'd better be good at it or else you'd better had quit long ago"
asciilifeform: ;;google just lather that's all
thestringpuller: wise words
mike_c: heh, you better be good at it or you won't have any fingers left
asciilifeform: ^ for some reason i always think of that piece when imagining Ar
thestringpuller: ;;calc 20000 * 365
gribble: 7300000
mircea_popescu: mike_c he held the thing by the fucking blade, too. a 12 inch knife sharp enough to slice beef on touch
Namworld: Well I'd sure like to know romania prices
Namworld: So... do we get to know the total cost?
mircea_popescu: heh, pansy barber.
mircea_popescu: Namworld yeah, soon enough
mircea_popescu: !up PeterGriffin
BingoBoingo: Namworld: What, and let the people who death ray'd his new MOBO death ray the Pineapples!!!
PeterGriffin: what up moither fuckers
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4952 @ 0.00085612 = 4.2395 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: PeterGriffin and who might you be?
PeterGriffin: god hates you if your not the non elect
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 647.26, Best ask: 648.86, Bid-ask spread: 1.60000, Last trade: 648.86, 24 hour volume: 6803.40421945, 24 hour low: 639.93, 24 hour high: 659.0, 24 hour vwap: 0
Namworld: BingoBoingo... what?
PeterGriffin: ;;help
gribble: The bot responds when you start a line with the ! character. A good starting point for exploring the bot is the !facts command. You can also visit the bot's website for a list of help topics and documentation: http://gribble.sourceforge.net/
BingoBoingo: Namworld: Did you miss the motherboard convo?
PeterGriffin: i smell a ban coming
Namworld: I guess I have
BingoBoingo: PeterGriffin: Are you that CalvinKlein from Friday
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: motherboard << ?
PeterGriffin: calvinklein? no
assbot: #bitcoin-assets bash
asciilifeform: aha that one
PeterGriffin: hiiiiiiiiiiiiiii
Mats_cd03: hiiii
PeterGriffin: god hates you if your not the non elect
assbot: Mayer Hawthorne - Crime (Lyric Video) ft. Kendrick Lamar - YouTube
BingoBoingo: hi =====
BingoBoingo: !down penguirker
assbot: The Sovereignty of God Versus Man-Made Religions, Hollywood Movies & Petty Emotionalism - YouTube
BingoBoingo: !down PeterGriffin
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 5 @ 0.025001 = 0.125 BTC [-]
Mats_cd03: i always laugh when i read comments about bitcoin on hn
asciilifeform: Mats_cd03: for some reason i thought the subject was forbidden there - unless posted by authorized phoundation shill
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PROV] 400 @ 0.002 = 0.8 BTC
mircea_popescu: that's not very far from truth asciilifeform
mircea_popescu: anyway : romanian prices, ~280 lei. /3.2 = 87.5 usd.
asciilifeform has the honour of running a site hellbanned on hn.
mircea_popescu: argentinian prices, 980 pesos. /11.4 = 85.96 usd.
mircea_popescu: CHEAPER!
assbot: Loper OS » Tenser, Said the Censor [*]
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform wait, you're NOT ONLY A WIKIPEDIA SPAMMER ARE YOU!!1
asciilifeform unrepentant spam desperado
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9385 @ 0.00085551 = 8.029 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: "Another common criticism of this practice has been that while in theory, it's a smart and effective way to discourage trolling, in actuality, the trolls and spammers are the first to become wise to this, and instead many innocent users get hurt, being unaware of what's going on."
mircea_popescu: in point of fact, hellbanning is exactly the opposite of this chan's +m
mircea_popescu: it has disadvantages in place of all the advantages, and no redeeming advantages whatsoever
mircea_popescu: other that being easy and cheap
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it's also an inescapable fact of life for idiots who insist on maintaining appearance of 'democracy!' while keeping the signal to noise ratio within some bounds
mircea_popescu: who's pg ?
mircea_popescu: greenspun ?
asciilifeform: (goes by pg on his site)
mircea_popescu: pretty good png to haveactually.
mircea_popescu: o that's what that recode shit coming out of nowhere is
asciilifeform: ^ taken on an apple box dusted off for the occasion, purposefully
mircea_popescu: mossberg got fired
mircea_popescu: i peripherally noticed there's yet another one of these web platform shits.
asciilifeform: (to anyone in usa, 'mossberg' is a '12' caliber shotgun)
mircea_popescu: with conferences and errything
mircea_popescu: brb dinner.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PROV] 60 @ 0.002 = 0.12 BTC
assbot: » Leaving Hacker News ASPENSMONSTER
asciilifeform: ^ some interesting discussion re: how hn works
asciilifeform: the auto-zap for nsa-related crap is especially entertaining (folks keep finding ways around it, mods play whackamole)
assbot: This comment defending Bitcoin got me hellbanned from "Hacker" News. : Bitcoin
asciilifeform: the interesting thing isn't that pg & co. zap posts they aren't particularly fond of. rather more interesting: the elaborate gymnastics to maintain a pretense of being an uncensored forum.
asciilifeform: 'reddit' may be a cesspool, but hn is a very special kind of echo hell.
benkay: <mircea_popescu> Mats_cd03: benkay is a queen << ahahaha they got yo numba nao vulpes. // y'all ain't even seen me in my heels yet
assbot: Facebook, Zuckerberg Sued Over Directors Compensation - Bloomberg
thestringpuller: fuck zuckerberg
thestringpuller: FUCK DAT GUY
mircea_popescu: assbot> » Leaving Hacker News ASPENSMONSTER << all these important things i've missed out on while doing other things.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform wait what ?! they don't discuss nsa ?~!
asciilifeform: all i can surmise is, pg would rather not.
benkay: distracts from fartup derpus
mircea_popescu: well, inasmuch as zombie is allowed to continue to exist, zombie is well advised to not be too critical of the decay process.
mircea_popescu: "Reddit seems to be one of the only places you can have true freedom of speech on the internet, and it thrives thanks to it. "
mircea_popescu: ahahaha help me rwanda
thestringpuller: true freedom of speech? da fuq does that even mean?
mircea_popescu: like the true scotsman
mircea_popescu: speech that conforms to one's priors is freedom of speech
mircea_popescu: speech that brings forth the cognitive dissonance one's priors suffer at the hands of reality is trolling
mike_c: mircea_popescu: walt mossberg??
mike_c: i remember 15 years ago coworkers sweating his reviews.
mircea_popescu: yeah him
mike_c: this could be like oprah leaving cable. he's not bigger than the journal.
mircea_popescu: dj fired him last year turns out, he started this recode thing january
mircea_popescu: he didnt leave, he got canned
mircea_popescu: prolly tried to resist a salary cut
mike_c: crazy. well, he'll find a paycheck somewhere.
mircea_popescu: doubt it.
mircea_popescu: he's running in the wrong track with the wrong dogs.
mircea_popescu: "It was autodeaded, presumably because of my use of the term “circlejerk,” which HN is quite sensitive to."
mircea_popescu: aahahaha
dub: gay
dub: er, gah*
assbot: Loper OS » Tungsten Will Melt in Your Mouth!
mircea_popescu: "I was recently met with a torrent of downvotes –nearly 100, might have actually crossed that– for poking fun at HN’s incessant we’re-not-reddit-we’re-much-more-sophisticated circlejerking"
mircea_popescu: o wait, because basically both hn and reddit are owned by the same dead media conglomerate is it
dub: the past caught up and is nutpunching me
mircea_popescu: so theykinda have a bit of an identity issue
mircea_popescu: like the mercury/ford
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 14920 @ 0.0000669 = 0.9981 BTC [+] {3}
mircea_popescu: Shame on me for continually pointing out this community’s obsession over being the “glorious master race” of online discussion whilst poo-pooing the cesspools of “filthy casuals” like Reddit or, god forbid, Slashdot.
mircea_popescu: ahahaha wait, WHAT ?
mircea_popescu: hacker news seriously thinks they matter somehow ?!
Namworld: Pretty much no one knows about hacker news.
mike_c: fb95e6a6f3843ea7fe22e08d08b20ead70ee3181b363916439a7c93da9b89c0d
mircea_popescu: i suppose that doesn't detract
asciilifeform: for a turdmeister, wielding the banhammer isn't really satisfying unless he imagines that he's adding heretics to an all-important 'index librorum prohibitorum'
mircea_popescu: mike_c wassat ?
mike_c: a prediction for later. i want proof that i called it.
thestringpuller: Hacker News has always throught they mattered I though...
asciilifeform: removing the miscreants from the universe of Things That Matter
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you wanna talk about nonsense items and the rotten paradigms they create and perpetuate ? teh banhammer. worse than risc.
asciilifeform: purely 'psychiatric' interest here.
mircea_popescu: worse than anything about c/c++
mircea_popescu: pure and simple, at some point in whatever, 1995, some derp with a blog/forum/platform came up with the idea of BANNING
mircea_popescu: and it's been sticking ever since, irrespective of how stupid it is.
mircea_popescu: mike_c now im curious
mike_c: i am predicting your announcement.
mircea_popescu: holy shit.
mircea_popescu: i'll bet you you aren't.
asciilifeform: there was to be an announcement ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4850 @ 0.00085582 = 4.1507 BTC [+] {2}
mike_c: hm, ok, i'll make a small wager. i'm not super-confident, but i think i've got it.
mircea_popescu: can be a bet for charity. whole bet goes to b-a donation address
mike_c: sounds good
mike_c: 0.5 btc?
mircea_popescu: so if you predicted it i send kako a btc, if not you do ?
mike_c: deal
mircea_popescu: pretty cool way to run a bet i say
thestringpuller: how do we know you didn't change the date of the announcement
mircea_popescu: who's we
dub: his nick isn't inaba or Luke-Jr?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I wonder why silver is the white metal everyone seems to horde and not gallium.
assbot: » Leaving Hacker News ASPENSMONSTER
mircea_popescu: "But in the absence of some system of law, the tiny minority of users out to do harm – intentionally or not – eventually drive out all the civil community members, leaving behind a lawless, chaotic badland."
mircea_popescu: this is such an amusing thing, because of all the utterly meaningless forums out there pretending to be communities and deluding themselves as to their own relevancy, not a single one would admit it's a failure
mircea_popescu: yet each and every one will pass this bit of "oh, leaving behind the broken spot"
mircea_popescu: nobody can point to such a broken spot on the interwebs, but nevertheless the apparent abundance of such is why every lemming wears plaid.
thestringpuller: When does something matter?
asciilifeform: announcement << i'll take the shot. mp to sell warehouses in Ar for btc.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PROV] 100 @ 0.002 = 0.2 BTC
dub: the fibers can easily be made fuzz. Being crushed and shortened in unit length, staple tends to become fly or dusts with ease and dispersed into atmosphere.Their Carbon Fiber users are advised to be careful not to dispose naked skins to the fibers and to take deliberate dusts cleaning measures naked skins.
dub: thank you japan
asciilifeform: dub: the infamous 'pencil in space capsule' problem
mircea_popescu: dub the fuzz is after you now ?
assbot: Join the Fuzz - We Love the Violence - YouTube
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12704 @ 0.00085529 = 10.8656 BTC [-] {2}
BingoBoingo: Is there a link to when this announcement was announced?
mircea_popescu: "That said, every community is different. I've personally talked to people in charge of large online communities – ones you probably participate in every day – and part of the reason those communities haven't broken down into utter chaos by now is because they secretly hellban and slowban their most problematic users. "
mircea_popescu: "i have talked to some people i won't name about some things i won't name but take my word on it that it's relevant, and they said my stupidity is entirely correct"
BingoBoingo: WTF is a slowban
mircea_popescu: how do these idiots live with themselves ?
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo apparently make your pages load slowly because whoever cares about your site sucking
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: slowban << poor site performance emulated for a very special someone
mircea_popescu: anyway, gotta remember that Jeff Atwood is pretty fucking stupid.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8000 @ 0.00085788 = 6.863 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo: What the fuck. Someone provokes annoyance in good faith and the response is now to lie and cover yourself in shit so they don't want to be seen around you?
mircea_popescu: this dovetails neatly with "women don't have to do anything in particular to not get fucked"
BingoBoingo: I have to wonder who the original autist was to come up with the idea of a slowban.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: afaik it was one of pg's flunkies.
asciilifeform: perhaps altman.
asciilifeform: (his vizier)
BingoBoingo: This has to be some clinically defective reasoning.
midnightmagic: what's a hellban?
asciilifeform: midnightmagic: hellban << victim thinks his posts show.
asciilifeform: he logs out - they're gone.
midnightmagic: oh yeah. Like +z. I love +z.
dub: aka /shun
dub: ircd ignores msgs, client cant tell
mircea_popescu: dub actually the material i've seen included a lot of derping about how fucking horrible and psychologically blabla that is.
mircea_popescu: so i guess the kids in charge have some deep seated issues with this sort of passive-agressive nonsense.
midnightmagic: sounds like new-age nonsense to me
dub: safest way to deal with some kinds of damage
midnightmagic: yeah, unfortunately :-/
mircea_popescu: dub so the guy you're "shunning" twists your nipples.
mircea_popescu: do you keep at it or what.
mircea_popescu: it's utterly dependent on you living in a boring environment. or in other words, if shunning works, your life sucks.
mircea_popescu: "enjoyment of the first look you take at a comment page is prioritized over active participation. That's great if you're trying to attach ads to pictures of cats, but if you're trying to have a real conversation, it just gets in the way. I can read, I don't need an algorithm to tell me which comments are notable and which ones are junk. If I see a troll post on any other site, I don't seize up and have an aneurism, I j
mircea_popescu: ust scroll past it.
mircea_popescu: I've said it before, and I'll say it again: I can easily follow 50+ page PHPbb threads that drag on for months or even years, or 4chan threads with hundreds of posts and more on the way every time you refresh, but a small conversation (in reality; I considered it huge by my HN standards) I had on here the other day with about 10 comments or so made my head spin. I wrote half the posts and it was still hard to follow! O
mircea_popescu: h, and of course, no one but the people I responded to will ever read the things I wrote hours after the thread dropped off the front page."
mircea_popescu: wow look at that : they actually understand what's wrong with the ~others~
mircea_popescu: The Reddit discussion model is completely oriented towards providing the fast food of news commentary, where your << missing 1st line
dub: life is not always a forum
mircea_popescu: exactly.
mircea_popescu: anyway, fun to see people on these very successful sites are lively debating solved problems in fain, years ago. makes my asshole swell.
asciilifeform: ;;google funarg problem
gribble: Funarg problem - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Funarg_problem>; The FUNARG Problem Explained - Software Preservation Group: <http://www.softwarepreservation.org/projects/LISP/MIT/Weizenbaum-FUNARG_Problem_Explained-1968.pdf>; FUNARG Problem - DSpace@MIT: <http://dspace.mit.edu/bitstream/handle/1721.1/5854/AIM-199.pdf>
asciilifeform: ^ a problem gleefully re-introduced by quite a few 'language of the day!' designers
asciilifeform: this kind of thing is the norm in techno-derpatronics
asciilifeform: dig up a (solved) problem (or, 'problem'), peddle solution (or 'solution'), ???, profit
thestringpuller: refreshing trilema hoping to see an announcement #assetslife
thestringpuller: but I guess with pankkake 's bot that's not necessary anymore
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform le suck.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 10 @ 0.025001 = 0.25 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: this is sometimes done in academia. as described in an infamous crackpot essay, 'stealing the chaos':
assbot: Beware of Stephen J. Gould - Less Wrong
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 8 @ 0.025001 = 0.2 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.23799979 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 16 @ 0.025 = 0.4 BTC [-] {3}
asciilifeform: (lw is another reddit clone that makes hn, etc. look sane. inhabited by folks terrified of robo-apocalypse. i was drummed out of lw as a 'future genocidal criminal' for... considering resurrecting doug lenat's 'eurisko.')
mircea_popescu: just how many of these social media sites did you get banned from ?
asciilifeform: tbh, i wasn't properly banned from any of them.
asciilifeform: login still functions
asciilifeform: ban isn't quite the word here
BingoBoingo: Kulakified?
asciilifeform: when you merit your own line of code in some turdmeister's db handler, but not banned... what do we call this.
mircea_popescu: banned lol
asciilifeform: in retrospect, being cast ashore from the shit-ocean was astonishingly good fortune.
asciilifeform: think how many potentially-interesting folks are floating there still.
TheNewDeal: why thank you assbot
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11300 @ 0.00085527 = 9.6646 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: well i guess with all teh encouragement ima make more travel log posts
TheNewDeal: do it
TheNewDeal: loved the mango and ginger breakfast picture as well
mircea_popescu: it turns out to be a pretty great breakfast!
mike_c: best part of winning a bitbet: gloating in the comments.
TheNewDeal: I love mango and I love ginger, but I haven't had the combination. Sounds like an indian dish to me
TheNewDeal: mike_c link?
assbot: BitBet - Simona Halep to win Roland Garros :: 1.03 B (14%) on Yes, 6.22 B (86%) on No | closed 2 weeks 1 day ago
TheNewDeal: aha saw it
TheNewDeal: can't believe 7 btc was laid down on that bet
TheNewDeal: usually the sports ones are sparse
mircea_popescu: mike_c btw, the coffee shop i happenedto stop for my pasteleria today (which dubs itself as a "local de encuentro" and during the night time doubles as a whorehouse) just happened to run the match on a large screen
TheNewDeal: and females tennis too..
mircea_popescu: i caught it starting with the 4-6 6-7 1-0 moment
mircea_popescu: that little shit gave sharapova a good run for her tits.
TheNewDeal: hahaha
mircea_popescu: at some point the russian fowled 5 serves in a row
assbot: Last 9 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/0DH2FTF.txt )
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SCRYPT] 10 @ 0.0251 = 0.251 BTC [+]
mike_c: hah, yeah, i'm glad i didn't watch it. too much of a sweat.
TheNewDeal: I'm very sad I didn't get to see the sexy Sharapova in action :(
mircea_popescu: nice legs yeah
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.2227057 BTC [-]
TheNewDeal: bc,stats
TheNewDeal: updating TheNewDeal's prediction to 6.3%
BingoBoingo: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 305040 | Current Difficulty: 1.1756551916903952E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 306431 | Next Difficulty In: 1391 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 1 day, 23 hours, 22 minutes, and 50 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 12115562214.2 | Estimated Percent Change: 3.0537
mircea_popescu: but what's the point/use for a changing prediction ?
TheNewDeal: gribble does it!
TheNewDeal: Yesterday was 4.8, 6/7 was 6.9%
TheNewDeal: gribble was guessing like 0% when I was guessing around 5
TheNewDeal: I play around with my model a little bit and try to make it look realist. Gribble and bitcoinwisdom are pretty much looking at something like the last 500 or 1000 blocks and predicting off that
TheNewDeal: will bitbet start reporting the results of their bets in the manner I was talking about yesterday?
TheNewDeal: Like Gain:X, Total Resolved: Y, Pending: Z
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5939 @ 0.00085513 = 5.0786 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: i think your talking about bitbet is incidental to what it'll actually do.
TheNewDeal: well of course
TheNewDeal: but if they're bets are going to be a large portion of the gains/losses, it seems like investors would want to know what their history has been on the bets
TheNewDeal: the way its reported now is just obscure
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: TheNewDeal Were you trying to trade Bastille Day bet Exposure yesterday?
TheNewDeal: I have bets on Yes , and I would still like to trade exposure
TheNewDeal: bitcoinpete picked up a mere .1 BTC when I am looking for more
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: How do these arrangements work? Suppose I wanted to trade some of my no for your yes, how do we price these?
TheNewDeal: oh I don
TheNewDeal: I don't want any of your no :D
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: Supposed you did, because we were both looking to hedge. How would this trade work?
TheNewDeal: the trade would work like this
TheNewDeal: you would give a amount, say 1 BTC, and we would tack on a timeweight to it
TheNewDeal: so you would send me 1 btc, and receive X timeweight
TheNewDeal: that I would pay out to your address
TheNewDeal: does that make any sense?
TheNewDeal: timeweight would be agreed upon beforehand
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: Sure. That's about half of the question's answer. What of instead of BTC for positions the trade was positions for positions?
TheNewDeal: thats possible. I have 5.6 total BTC in for a timeweight of ~197,000. Care to share what you're trying to trade?
mircea_popescu: <TheNewDeal> but if they're bets are going to be a large portion of the gains/losses, it seems like investors would want to know what their history has been on the bets << you know investors can readily revbiew this as they're all published
mircea_popescu: so far the house is ahead, mike_c did the math recently.
mircea_popescu: !up pgrewr
mike_c: well, house bets are ahead. the house isn't because it gives away half the bets.
TheNewDeal: MP, but recently they have upped the amounts they bet, by a large amoutn
TheNewDeal: correct?
mircea_popescu: TheNewDeal not afaik
mircea_popescu: mike_c right.
TheNewDeal: hmmm I'm going to have to do some research. thought I read something that said they were upping the amount of BTC bet
TheNewDeal: perhaps it was around the time MPIF came about?
pgrewr: homosexuals should be put to death
mircea_popescu: always been .1
mircea_popescu: tis in th faq
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: Well, let's not reveal the particular bet since we are miming what making such a deal would look like and Assume I have this position http://bitbet.us/bet/677/bitcoin-network-difficulty-14bn-on-bastille-day/#b39 And would like to swap half of the balance for a favorably priced yes position.
assbot: BitBet - Bitcoin network difficulty > 14Bn on Bastille day :: 112.84 B (85%) on Yes, 19.55 B (15%) on No | closing in 3 days 20 hours | weight: 2`243 (100`000 to 1)
BingoBoingo: How do we go about pricing No at a weight TheNewDeal versus yes at a weight?
TheNewDeal: well it wouldn't really make too much sense for me financially, unless you had much more timeweight
TheNewDeal: i take that back
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: It could though which is why the pricing of these things and how to do it is so important.
TheNewDeal: let me do a quick calculation
mircea_popescu: !up Hoodmin
Hoodmin: Evenin coiners
BingoBoingo: Evening Hoodmin
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: I'm curious, are you running Bitbet.py?
assbot: Iran unveils finger amputating machine for use on thieves - Telegraph
TheNewDeal: what is bitbet.py?
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: Do you have a more interesting tool for calculating Bitbet outcomes then?
TheNewDeal: i use excel or simply Calculator
mike_c: i do :) i should clean up some of my scripts and publish them sometime..
assbot: Is bitbet.us buggy? | Bitcointa.lk
TheNewDeal: ;;calc 16.3/678*112.8+.99*1
gribble: 3.70185840708
TheNewDeal: not too hard
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: It's a simple tool. You past in the lines from bitbet and get the whole thing laid out.
mike_c: old skool. it should grab the json.
mike_c: blech. i feel another bitbet blog post coming on.
BingoBoingo: Well, it is a relic of BitBet's earlier days
TheNewDeal: ill definitely check it out
TheNewDeal: but it's easy enough for me to quickly find the payout of one or two bets
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: Yeah, but I usually like to survey the whole field at once. Creates a real appreciation of time weight
TheNewDeal: touche
BingoBoingo: Helps you identify interesting bettors as well
TheNewDeal: besides the point
TheNewDeal: the maximum i stand to make on my yes prop is 1.25 btc with 5.6 bet (assuming no more NO bets come)
TheNewDeal: if I purchased your whole position, I would make 3.78% on yes, or lose 28.8 percent
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: Assume we are hedgine and trading smaller amounts. Who would we price deciBitcoin portions of each position.
TheNewDeal: let's say I were to send you a fraction of a BTC (let's say a half) on the no bet. Would you consider giving me a larger timeweight than what you have bet at?
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: I'd actually be more interested in swapping a fraction of the no for a fraction of the Yes. If we are trading Bitcoin against the position... I'd maybe be interested in offering a bit of extra timeweight.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: why silver is the white metal everyone seems to horde and not gallium << Ga is typically found in bauxite, so it had to wait for cheap Al refinement.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: That explains the problem historically, but not why it persists.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: in principle, it would make a pretty good 'low tech testable' precious metal. simply determine melting point.
TheNewDeal: My position will currently pay out 1.22 per 1 invested, but I have like 4X more invested, so it doesn't make much sense to buy a small fraction
BingoBoingo: Indeed more testable.
BingoBoingo: ;;calc 3.70185840708*0.5
gribble: 1.85092920354
assbot: BtcAlpha.com F.MPIF Tracker estimated NAV per share: 0.00021706 BTC (Total: 434.13 BTC). Last trade for F.MPIF on MPEX was at 0.00021725 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: I'm thinking rather than adjusting time weight which could create a bit of a pickle if a lot of large late betting acticity swoops in we consider the matter of pricing a 0.5 stake in terms of the premium or discount applied to 0.5 BTC to purchase it.
[]bot: Bet placed: 10 BTC for No on "1BTC >= $10,000 USD" http://bitbet.us/bet/635/ Odds: 16(Y):84(N) by coin, 19(Y):81(N) by weight. Total bet: 474.9239018 BTC. Current weight: 45,777.
[]bot: Bet placed: 3 BTC for No on "BTC worth over $5000 before 2015" http://bitbet.us/bet/716/ Odds: 42(Y):58(N) by coin, 43(Y):57(N) by weight. Total bet: 13.25076814 BTC. Current weight: 54,957.
TheNewDeal: first off, I don't think there will be any late bettors here
TheNewDeal: secondly, if there are, it will only help my position
TheNewDeal: the yes pays less than half a percent at 1 btc
BingoBoingo: No one ever anticipates snackman...
assbot: Pensioners lose savings in government cash grab
TheNewDeal: we could definitely swap, but I don't see how it would help you out
TheNewDeal: yes timeweight pays out not so much
BingoBoingo: TheNewDeal: So for 0.5 BTC of my no stake you would pay 0.? BTC
TheNewDeal: that doesn't work out for me
BingoBoingo: Ah, so what works again? You want to pay ? for a stake with the timeweight adjusted upwards? Wouldn't it be easier to adjust the price paid or the portion of the stake purchased?
TheNewDeal: let me go over an example scenario
TheNewDeal: if I were to purchase .33 BTC at 30K timeweight
TheNewDeal: for me I would be winning 10% on my investment of 5.9 BTC on YES, or returning 27% of that investment on no
TheNewDeal: you on the other hand, would bring in 1.06 BTC for an investment of (1-.33 = .67 btc)
TheNewDeal: for NO
← 2014-06-08 | 2014-06-10 → ↑
Random(trilema) | Download hourly DB snapshot | Get Source Code