Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2014-04-27 | 2014-04-29 → ↓
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7000 @ 0.00095741 = 6.7019 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16300 @ 0.00095382 = 15.5473 BTC [-] {2}
ozbot: Speed reading apps may kill comprehension | Ars Technica
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 24 @ 0.00444 = 0.1066 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 41 @ 0.00451316 = 0.185 BTC [+]
ozbot: Doctor Grumpy in the House: Holy shit I'm rich!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16900 @ 0.00095301 = 16.1059 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35200 @ 0.00095632 = 33.6625 BTC [+] {3}
ozbot: Who's minding the nukes? - CBS News
bitcoinpete: floppy disks ftw!
bitcoinpete: "the equipment is ancient. This, for example, is one of the computers that would receive a launch order from the president. It uses floppy disks! The really old, big ones."
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13950 @ 0.0009576 = 13.3585 BTC [+] {2}
BingoBoingo: Well... Why not floppy disks
bitcoinpete: "And they're using really, really, really old computers. I saw a floppy disc and not a floppy disc that size. It was gigantic."
bitcoinpete: BingoBoingo: zero reason not to
bitcoinpete: other than neomania
bitcoinpete: "I'll tell you, those older systems provide us some -- I will say huge safety when it comes to some cyber issues that we currently have in the world."
bitcoinpete: "A few years ago we did a complete analysis of our entire network. Cyber engineers found out that the system is extremely safe and extremely secure on the way it's developed."
BingoBoingo: I mean what other computers would be running launch systems? Some 28nm ARM thing that runs Java?
bitcoinpete: "We're not up on the Internet." <<def helps
bitcoinpete: BingoBoingo: or a used ps3
bitcoinpete: "The land-based intercontinental ballistic missiles, the ICBMs, that we saw are just one part of the nuclear triad that includes missiles on submarines and bombers. The Congressional Budget Office estimates that operating and upgrading all three legs of the triad is going to cost at least $355 billion over the next 10 years."
BingoBoingo: Still less expensive than the F-35 that doesn't work
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21700 @ 0.00095189 = 20.656 BTC [-]
bitcoinpete: So this random dude e-mails me recently, offering to set me up with ltb's adam levine for an interview about maidsafe
bitcoinpete: cuz i'm an expert on them or something
bitcoinpete: and i don't know levine already
bitcoinpete: so anyways i ask the guy what he doing in/with bitcoin and he says he "just left a start-up and wants to be a core dev"
cazalla: BingoBoingo: Australia is buying 58 of those F-35's :\
bitcoinpete: naturally, i prod further and his area of interests is sidechains because they "fix bitcoin's incentive problems"
BingoBoingo: cazalla: Seem like a lot of countries are
bitcoinpete: does the guy of pgp/gpg? nope, "The PGP/GPG stuff has been on my list to figure out for a few months, but I haven't gotten around to it yet. I've only recently started caring (somewhat) about security since getting into Bitcoin."
bitcoinpete: sounds like a perfect power ranger candidate. i hope he's cool being blue
BingoBoingo: !up Dimsler
assbot: Voicing Dimsler for 30 minutes.
bitcoinpete: cazalla: canada is too
bitcoinpete: we were talking about 65 of them to the tune of $25M or so
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.068996 = 0.138 BTC [+]
cazalla: still, i'd rather the au gov spend the money on planes than more and more welfare
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 3 @ 0.07010101 = 0.2103 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 7 @ 0.07 = 0.49 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49700 @ 0.00095805 = 47.6151 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 17 @ 0.06899838 = 1.173 BTC [+] {5}
bitcoinpete: cazalla: if those are the choices, then sure
bitcoinpete: defense > decay
cazalla: i don't vote so i guess i don't have a choice not that i would even if i did
Naphex: morning
ozbot: Sfantul Efrem, ocrotitorul Clujului, repara calculatoare si tamaduieste constipatia | Ziar de Cluj
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25700 @ 0.00095913 = 24.6496 BTC [+] {2}
bitcoinpete: north korea keeps it simple stupid
BingoBoingo: Best Korea for a reason
bitcoinpete: "There’s a very simple way to distinguish actual people from non-people. It’s not whether their grandmother was Jewish or their hair is curly, it’s not whether their skin tone is this or that shade of purple, it’s not even if they do well in school, suck cock rapturously, work hard, obey the laws, go to church, respect their elders, floss, whatever the hell else. None of that matters."
bitcoinpete: "Actual people are always on the lookout for games to put skin in. Everybody else just knows better, from the waysides."
bitcoinpete: mircea_popescu on the money
ozbot: Soft consensus, aka fecal matter. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
bitcoinpete: and that's a wrap!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 29 @ 0.0689998 = 2.001 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 1 @ 0.14 BTC
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6308 @ 0.00095568 = 6.0284 BTC [-]
atcbot: [X-BT] Bid: 155 Ask: 200 Last Price: 199 24h-Vol: 1770k High: 230 Low: 150 VWAP: 186
atcbot: 10k@245 65k@240 2k@200 | 10k@155 10k@151 100k@150
mircea_popescu: mod6 splendid :D
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23700 @ 0.00095857 = 22.7181 BTC [+] {3}
Apocalyptic: 24h-Vol: 1770k // that's like the monthly volume last month
mircea_popescu: Apocalyptic lol growth eh ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.0345 = 0.1035 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 1770000*186
gribble: 329220000
mircea_popescu: 3.x btc ? getting to be pretty respectable for a scamcoin.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: mornings
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6150 @ 0.00095934 = 5.8999 BTC [+] {2}
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: I've been flipping through the MPOE account statements for a blog post on running a profitable BTC business, is there a cumulative count of dividends paid per share that you've published at any point?
mircea_popescu: yes, but it's old. lemme see ehre.
ozbot: MPEx : one year of dividends pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mircea_popescu: if you'd find it within your heart to publish the 2nd year of dividends, same format, that'd actually be helpful.
fluffypony: ok cool
mircea_popescu: maybe mike_c does one too, then we can see if your numbers match.
fluffypony: I haven't had enough coffee - can you explain the relative dividend yield? surely the dividends are absolute?
mircea_popescu: yes but each month the stock has an average price
fluffypony: ah ok
ozbot: oclHashcat - advanced password recovery
mircea_popescu: whoa iron dropped ? coal dropped ?! this is a new one.
mircea_popescu: ;;google site:log.bitcoin-assets.com bitevery
gribble: NEXT: 07-05-2013 - #bitcoin-assets log: <http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-05-2013&bots=true>; NEXT: 12-09-2013 - #bitcoin-assets log: <http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-09-2013&bots=true>
mircea_popescu: google you fucking suck wtf, it's in neither.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 380 @ 0.06279784 = 23.8632 BTC [-] {46}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.06889296 = 0.3445 BTC [+] {2}
Naphex: :D
Naphex: good day today
ozbot: New Quantum Theory Could Explain the Flow of Time | Science | WIRED
mircea_popescu: hopefully he gets extradited.
Naphex: if you haven't seen it
Naphex: :)
mircea_popescu: Naphex lmao wut.
Naphex: “Asadar, s-a rugat Sfantului Efrem cel Nou si a facut de trei ori Semnul Sfintei Cruci peste computer. Spre marea sa uimire, nu numai ca a reusit sa deschida fisierul, ci a putut sa stearga integral sectiunea corupta”
Naphex: so... :D
mircea_popescu: (ie... sf leufteriu of the L.o.L. ?)
Naphex: :))
mircea_popescu: lmao no fucking way, that's the actual site of the moldavian bishopric
mircea_popescu: ahahahaah
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.06763971 = 0.1353 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 50 @ 0.14 = 7 BTC
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: btw just noticed on http://trilema.com/2013/bitcoind-not-quite-ready-for-prime-time/ - "unspeficied"
mircea_popescu: that's too cute to fix
ozbot: BitBet - F.MPIF to last the year
moiety: awww! i think the sombrero wins the hat contest!
mircea_popescu: Instead, this week we found out the Most Transparent Administration in American History™ has implemented a new anti-press policy that would make Richard Nixon blush. National intelligence director James Clapper, the man caught lying to Congress from an "unauthorized" leak by Snowden, issued a directive to the employees of all 17 intelligence agencies barring all employees from any "unauthorized" contact with the pres
mircea_popescu: teh soviets are coming hurray hurray
mircea_popescu: this is so 1978
Apocalyptic: <mircea_popescu> http://bitbet.us/bet/817/f-mpif-to-last-/ lol srsly ? // isn't that a badbet ?
mircea_popescu: well to the degree betting on any fiat stock being delisted is, i guess.
mircea_popescu: or what did you have in mind ?
Apocalyptic: as it's in solely your authority to decide the outcome
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 4 @ 0.065 = 0.26 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: schizopathically & antisocially i seem to count myself as an institution.
mircea_popescu: pankkake:
mircea_popescu: mod6: I just stopped my trades bot, so you can display yours. << hows that work ?
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell decimation you left out the best part : "Without a hierarchical structure it is not possible to transform freedom from a fable into a fact."
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: ;;later tell decimation o no oyu didn't. nm :p
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: ;;seen scrat
gribble: scrat was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 24 weeks, 1 day, 11 hours, 20 minutes, and 46 seconds ago: <Scrat> im a fat cock
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 5 @ 0.07089996 = 0.3545 BTC [+] {2}
ozbot: Imposture
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 250 @ 0.00085 = 0.2125 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17100 @ 0.00095804 = 16.3825 BTC [-] {2}
fluffypony: fuck that confused me
ozbot: MPEx : one year of dividends pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
fluffypony: BBET is listed as paying from Jan
fluffypony: when first dividend payout was Feb
mircea_popescu: well yes but it was for the month of jan
fluffypony: yes but if you take the dividends table on the listing page for MPOE it correlates to "month in which it was paid" pretty much
fluffypony: for eg. the first dividend was paid on 26-05-12 and is listed as the May 2012 dividend
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12600 @ 0.00095896 = 12.0829 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 5 @ 0.07089996 = 0.3545 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 4 @ 0.07092901 = 0.2837 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29988 @ 0.00095992 = 28.7861 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: and had it been paid 3-06-2012 it'd still have been the may dividend
mircea_popescu: this because for most of its life mpoe reported on a "last week of month" period, and reports came in within hours of exercise closure, so it almost always was within the month.
HeySteve: <+mircea_popescu> "Without a hierarchical structure it is not possible to transform freedom from a fable into a fact." <- there should be a science of resilient hierarchical structures which resist corruption and decay. it should draw from historical fact, military tactics and decentralised methods. it should inform a technocratic leadership.
mircea_popescu: whereas everyone else reported by the 5th of next calendar month, so it always was later
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 4 @ 0.0674425 = 0.2698 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: HeySteve yes, there is such a science. what do you think we're doing here.
HeySteve: do you mean this channel or Bitcoin?
mircea_popescu: i mean this channel, mpex, etc.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.0345 = 0.1035 BTC [+]
HeySteve: Bitcoin should be a sovereign
mircea_popescu: just pastebin it, i aint js.
mircea_popescu: HeySteve it... is. it has been, for a while. hence the serenissima.
HeySteve: this is not widely recognised, mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: that matters :))
mircea_popescu: like you know, there's this lion in an african village, and the local peasants are... not recognizing it.
mircea_popescu: im sure the lion's all hurt and emo over it.
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: no js on the page
HeySteve: that sounds dangerous for the villagers
fluffypony: or none that needs to execute to see the table
mircea_popescu: HeySteve exactly. letting people know about how their lives depend on bitcoin-ability is a charitable deed.
mircea_popescu: fluffypony wouldja just pastebin the thing ?
fluffypony: I'll pastebin the markdown source
mircea_popescu: wrong years lol
fluffypony: whoops
mircea_popescu: Mar 2013 | 17 | 122
fluffypony: fixed those last 3
fluffypony: apparently I'm stuck in 2013 :-P
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26700 @ 0.00096052 = 25.6459 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: anyway, best make it a full year, so wait a few days to include apr too
fluffypony: can do
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 123 @ 0.00096116 = 0.1182 BTC [+]
fluffypony: ;;later tell duffer1 well when you can't decide whether your name is "Timothy" or "Jimmy" it's unsurprising that you'd self-identify as an "investor" despite never really invested in anything:-P
gribble: The operation succeeded.
mircea_popescu: "this guy is giving me the timmy-jimmies", voted most likely to succeed coinage of 2014.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16410 @ 0.00095947 = 15.7449 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: "Office space alone can eat you alive. Between Pissy and I we have 2100 square feet. And we're paying $5100 a month for that. "
mircea_popescu: someone's in business with a partner known as... pissy ?!
mircea_popescu: now that is true. pussy is an energy drink.
mircea_popescu: "3. CEO at my hospital laid off 10% of the nurses last year and got a $7M bonus."
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: It's what he refers to his urologist office mate as
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo old cranky doctors are some of my favourite party people.
mircea_popescu: they have this well patined sense of humor.
mircea_popescu: Price. $3.00 for drink plus shipping. Shipping International: 1-2 = $23.95 - Small Flat Rate 4-8 = $77.95 - Large Flat Rate
mircea_popescu: dude srsly ? 15 bux for a bottle of carbonated pisswater ?
mircea_popescu: anyway, they do the office practice here too. most romanians are insured by virtue of going to work, the cost is about $100 per month. most rich romanians don't bother with the state insurance and just pay out of pocket.
mircea_popescu: typical office overhead for a doctor's office is in the 10 to 15k a year, all inclusive, typical doctor visit is $100 or less (depending, GP is like $10)
mircea_popescu: average doctor makes 20x minimum wage, 3x average wage.
mircea_popescu: somehow a country larger than the entire fucking cascadia can function on 1/10 to 1/100 of the us costs.
mircea_popescu: and i would argue healthcare, tho not stellar, is better here than there.
BingoBoingo: It's amazing how these things work out
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
fluffypony: bitcoinpete:naturally, i prod further and his area of interests is sidechains because they "fix bitcoin's incentive problems" <- with that attitude he's well on his way to being part of the Bitcoin Foundation, maybe he should just apply for a seat?
cazalla: difficult to find a good GP in Australia, the older doctors are few and far between but will allow you adequate time, the younger GP's are usually found in medical centres where the aim is to get you in and out ASAP to bulk bill medicare as much as possible
HeySteve: Peter Todd had a strong point against sidechains
ozbot: BitBet - TradeFortress arrested
fluffypony: comment spamz
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 4 @ 0.0405 = 0.162 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 3 @ 0.0742218 = 0.2227 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: bitcoinpete:
mircea_popescu: so anyways i ask the guy what he doing in/with bitcoin and he says he "just left a start-up and wants to be a core dev" << so send him here.
mircea_popescu: and to think that he could have a banner for .1 btc
cazalla: i went to a walk in medical centre with issues about my neck as I couldn't get an appointment at my usual GP, the GP at the walk in just assumed I was after pain meds and wrote a script for endone (oxycodone) without any hesitation to get me the fuck out of there
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: that's what I was commenting on above, he sounds like an ideal Bitcoin Foundation candidate
moiety: BingoBoingo: seriously?!
BingoBoingo: moiety: About what?
moiety: bitbet
mircea_popescu: cazalla nutty.
fluffypony: cazalla: so you took the script and sold it on SR?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.0674425 = 0.1349 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: HeySteve lol that korea customs form rules. "please say if you have any magicks kthx"
moiety: cazalla: that's ridiculous, folk like that shouldn't be doctors
cazalla: moiety: he was actually struck off this year for getting personal with a patient heh - http://www.illawarramercury.com.au/story/2167211/court-hears-dapto-doctor-defend-examination/
cazalla: there's actually been 3 or 4 doctors struck off for similar things at that place, not that i knew at the time, it was the only place open late
mircea_popescu: "A doctor charged with sexually assaulting a patient at Dapto Medical Centre has told a court he took the unusual step of stimulating the woman on his clinic couch after she clamped down on his finger with her private parts, aggravating an injury to his shoulder."
moiety: "I had to think of something that would relax her ... I thought I'd stimulate her clitoris to get access to the inside to do that proper examination, hoping that she'd relax." WTF .... a woman that avoided internal exams .... kden thats really going to relax her
dub: that deserves stella award
moiety: deserves a smack in the face
moiety: they have tools for that kind of thing
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9328 @ 0.00095915 = 8.947 BTC [-] {2}
moiety: one of our locum psychiatrists allegedly propositioned a stripper in her appointment. he actually went to her club and asked for her by name later
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: question on the gpg wot
fluffypony: when you import someone's pubkey and set their trust level
fluffypony: it updates your keyring
fluffypony: how do you push that updated keyring to the keyserver?
mircea_popescu: you export their pubkey
fluffypony: --send-keys just pushes my key, not the trust level
mircea_popescu: but... the trust level it's your own
moiety: she complained about him and he had to leave. big court case and everything about it.
mircea_popescu: anyway, the gpg wot is imo a broken beyond belief implementaiton
mircea_popescu: and shouldn't be called a wot in the first place.
fluffypony: well they broke it the minute they started having "signing parties" at every con in existence
mircea_popescu: moiety wait. stripper complained about customer asking for her by name ?!
fluffypony: because that's a great basis for "trust"
mircea_popescu: what is she, insane ?
moiety: no he wasnt a customer, he was her psychiatrist
mircea_popescu: fluffypony early internet people held the idiotic belief that "meeting irl" is some sortt of gold standard.
mircea_popescu: hence all the "you wouldn't say that to my face" bs
moiety: she was mid-moan about her life and he asked her for a blowjob apparently
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: yeah, which was the number 1 reason why I never went to another IRC meet after my first one in 1997
mircea_popescu: it's a common mistake of the pompously clueless, and good sister of the entire "trolls are bad for society" mtyh
mircea_popescu: moiety heh. so dude was creepy.
fluffypony: moiety: she could have transitioned from one type of moan to another
fluffypony: and gotten her therapy fees back with interest
moiety: i think this was his plan fluffypony
mircea_popescu: fluffypony yeah but she was paying so she doesn't have to.
moiety: mircea_popescu: well he was actually. to everyone. but she was also nuts, so it did make things difficult. he is still working
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53250 @ 0.00096178 = 51.2148 BTC [+] {5}
mircea_popescu: moiety there's this confusion being peddled, in classic libertard manner, that it's the form rather than the substance. however, in my experience it's absolutely never THE FACT that he propositioned her that is the issue.
mircea_popescu: it's just that he sucks, ie, the substance of that proposition.
mircea_popescu: otherwise, i've hit on doctors/nurses/people in the street/whoever the fuck. what's the big deal.
mircea_popescu: if a society isn't willing to put up with "inappropriate" propositioning, that society will have to put up with specially designated "proposition pens" where everyone's fcking awkward and the whole thing's unpleasant.
mircea_popescu: former option much better.
moiety: this is true. the problem with him being picking someone that had severe issues around it when he was in a position of trust rather than a nurse/doctor/person in the street
fluffypony: lawlz seedcoin: "We have regular contacts with institutional investors, I am not sure how many institutional investors may have expressed a lack of confidence (publicly or to you) in what we do, if they have I would be happy to answer their concerns, but I wished to inform you that the institutional and angel investors we have been in contact with have expressed great confidence in Seedcoin and our support to crypto startups."
mircea_popescu: but you're always in a position of trust. this "position of trust" analysis is bollocks. at the very least you trust the random passerby not to mug you.
mircea_popescu: tell him my concerns are that he's a fucktard, and ask him to please address them.
fluffypony: which was their response to me raising 14 questions on the TagPesa crap they're trying to piddle: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=586230.msg6418858#msg6418858
mircea_popescu: curious if he'll go the "o mp is not an institutional investor, because breaking the back of everyone else does not qualify one" or "he said fucktard so i no longer have to listen nao lalalala"
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Well rather than an institutional investor I've just assumed you've transcended to being the institution
mircea_popescu: !up HoreaV
assbot: Voicing HoreaV for 30 minutes.
moiety: re rtust this is true mircea_popescu but shouldn't you be able to trust your doctor to keep professional at least while in an appointment?
moiety: trust*
mircea_popescu: why should "professional" exclude flirting ?
mircea_popescu: you should be able to trust your doctor not to be unpleasant, of which you are the only judge. and if you don't like him go to another. which is why the free market is important.
Naphex: ;;rate HoreaV 10 Horea Vuscan of BTCXchange.ro
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 10 for user HoreaV has been recorded.
moiety: asking someone who is crying about their daddy issues to suck your dick isn't flirting tho
mircea_popescu: a doctor shouldn't have to follow some ultimately absurd behaviour guidelines, because he's an adult, and a patient should not have to depend that the doctor does follow such, or that they're adequate, because he has no options.
mircea_popescu: no argument there.
mircea_popescu: but the problem is he sucked, basically.
moiety: bottom line. ^ yeah
fluffypony: or that he *wanted* to be sucked
mircea_popescu: ends up generally misrepresented as "well the problem is he propositioned her". nonsense. the problem is he apparently has the discernment of a five year old.
moiety: i did have a female doctor who a patient leave her caseload because she was seen out at a pub on a weekend, which was ridiculous.
mircea_popescu: yeah but i mean... patient's call.
mircea_popescu: i know women who won't use a male gyn, to their detriment, as male gyns are usually better. but hey, her lyf, her call.
moiety: thats often a comfort thing
moiety: and yeah we switched around doctors whenever the patients wanted
mircea_popescu: kinda why the male gyns are better, too. they don't have one so it's scary on some level.
moiety: male midwives get a hard time too
mircea_popescu: HoreaV hey there ?
mircea_popescu: ;;gettrust assbot davide
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user davide: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=davide | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=davide | Rated since: never
HoreaV: mircea_popescu: hey back, Naphex is still setting me up with the console and explaining. i'll be done in a sec
atcbot: [X-BT] Bid: 155 Ask: 200 Last Price: 199 24h-Vol: 1715k High: 230 Low: 150 VWAP: 187
HoreaV: ;;rate Naphex 10 Best programmer that i ever worked with. Cofounder at BTCXchange.ro
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 10 for user Naphex has been recorded.
mircea_popescu: ;;rate HoreaV 1 btcxchange.ro
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user HoreaV has been recorded.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30600 @ 0.00095596 = 29.2524 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 100 @ 0.0045101 = 0.451 BTC [-]
cazalla: moiety: didn't see any male midwives while my wife was in hospital (private), i wouldn't mind being a lactation consultant, it was pretty sweet watching the younger ones caress the missus' tits for milk :P
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23050 @ 0.00096077 = 22.1457 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45850 @ 0.00096436 = 44.2159 BTC [+] {5}
mircea_popescu: wao hey, can you send me a shipment of those copper rounds ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17935 @ 0.00096269 = 17.2658 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22000 @ 0.00096043 = 21.1295 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12200 @ 0.00096515 = 11.7748 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.06724331 = 0.6724 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.06724331 = 0.1345 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 53 @ 0.0075 = 0.3975 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11650 @ 0.00096572 = 11.2506 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15400 @ 0.00096609 = 14.8778 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19000 @ 0.00096346 = 18.3057 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17400 @ 0.00096624 = 16.8126 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.51123251 = 1.0225 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.51199998 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 100 @ 0.0046345 = 0.4635 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.06724331 = 0.2017 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 4 @ 0.0345 = 0.138 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 7 @ 0.03450588 = 0.2415 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.0409979 = 0.123 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.03450687 = 0.1035 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.0409979 = 0.205 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 10 @ 0.0409979 = 0.41 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 7 @ 0.0409979 = 0.287 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.0409979 = 0.205 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 9 @ 0.04099792 = 0.369 BTC [+] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.04099999 = 0.123 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.0742218 = 0.1484 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25500 @ 0.0009663 = 24.6407 BTC [+] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 24 @ 0.00445218 = 0.1069 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12350 @ 0.00096646 = 11.9358 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47600 @ 0.00096636 = 45.9987 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4768 @ 0.0009666 = 4.6087 BTC [+]
fluffypony: kakobrekla: I've actually got another blog post that is just waiting for April results, I'll include a link to that in it
pankkake: it even mentions AsicMiner, so humble of MP
fluffypony: kakobrekla: does blogs.bitcoin-assets.com auto-update or is it manual?
pankkake: I'm the one running it
fluffypony nearly said manul and was waiting for moiety to show up
pankkake: and it's every 37 minutes or so
fluffypony: oic oic
pankkake: I might do it more, I didn't want to hammer your blogs too much, but it's actually quite smart (it checks the last modified date of the rss if it can provide one)
pankkake: next step is a bot to notify of new posts
fluffypony: maybe assbot should poll the rss feed to watch for changes?
kakobrekla: pankkake do you run a cronjob there or is that site built on the fly
kakobrekla: ah right
pankkake: it's a cron, so everything is static
kakobrekla: 37 minuts
kakobrekla should read moar
pankkake: it was 42 minutes. I'm changing to 7 :)
kakobrekla: well how about you post a new post notification to me?
pankkake: I'm looking at how I can do that with venus (the tool I use to build blogs.b-a). the sending to irc part is easy, I already have a dumb bot for that
pankkake: otherwise I'll do it with a RSS parser I know, which already handles the "is this thing new" aspect
pankkake: but if I can avoid polling myself…
kakobrekla: i can make assbot polll
kakobrekla: its not ideal but yea
kakobrekla: json would been better
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33329 @ 0.00096692 = 32.2265 BTC [+] {3}
HeySteve: RyS eh
HeySteve: from the thread you link, rethink your strategy
fluffypony: oh yes
fluffypony: that thread got really trashy
fluffypony: still a fun read
HeySteve: heh OP started it that way
fluffypony: yeah, I love how at the end he's like "I'm going to litecointalk!"
fluffypony: as if that's a bastion of legitimacy :-P
pankkake: he got really really mad
HeySteve: people should start with businesses they can achieve with their own resources
pankkake: that crumbs guy is a hero
HeySteve: seeking funding for My First Bizniz is not credible
pankkake: HeySteve: and in most cases, those things don't even need the funding they ask…
fluffypony: yeah, that's why I keep asking for them to justify the expense
fluffypony: show me 1 calculation with sub-totals
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25700 @ 0.00096591 = 24.8239 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15500 @ 0.00096941 = 15.0259 BTC [+] {2}
thestringpuller: ;;google change clothes and go
gribble: JAY-Z - Change Clothes ft. Pharrell - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6G1uwe20wg>; Jay Z – Change Clothes Lyrics | Rap Genius: <http://rapgenius.com/Jay-z-change-clothes-lyrics>; JAY-Z LYRICS - Change Clothes: <http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/jayz/changeclothes.html>
BCB: who runs Cryptostocks.com
gribble: Nick 'thestringpuller', with hostmask 'thestringpuller!~leflor@99-39-97-12.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net', is identified as user 'thestringpuller', with GPG key id 0FF2943DA179E169, key fingerprint 6ACE36E786F39A4ADC4506DE0FF2943DA179E169, and bitcoin address None
thestringpuller: BCB: does it not say on the site?
BCB: anonymous registration
BCB: I never heard of htem
BCB: them
BCB: you
thestringpuller: never used them
BCB: anyone know Vircurex
pankkake: BCB: a guy named kumala
thestringpuller: vircurex is canadian no?
BCB: pankkake: who is kumala
BCB: thestringpuller: eys
BCB: yes
BCB: what about havelock investments
pankkake: no idea, besides a bitcointalk username
thestringpuller: so havelock is definitely in scam territory now?
thestringpuller: good thing i vacated
thestringpuller: !last h b.mine
assbot: Last trade for B.MINE on HAVELOCK was at 0.034 BTC [-]
fluffypony: pankkake: is the rss poll broken? my most recent blog post isn't showing up
thestringpuller: fluffypony don't use rss then
fluffypony: thestringpuller: I meant his poll to my rss feed :)
thestringpuller: you're a special one aren't you?
pankkake: I see "How to fail gracefully as a Bitcoin business"
fluffypony: it's at the bottom
fluffypony: see it
fluffypony: tks :)
fluffypony needs more coffee
pankkake: but I've had an instance of it not updating trilema, so maybe it wasn't there earlier
BCB: thestringpullerso havelock is definitely in scam territory now? << Why do you say that
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10850 @ 0.00096701 = 10.4921 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11600 @ 0.00096601 = 11.2057 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9916 @ 0.00096942 = 9.6128 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: because it is doing untrustworthy things
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 1006 @ 0.001 = 1.006 BTC {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 190 @ 0.001 = 0.19 BTC
mike_c: ;;seen davout
gribble: davout was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 3 days, 2 hours, 34 minutes, and 59 seconds ago: <davout> random_cat: wet pussies are the consequence of so much log, not the other way around
fluffypony: he was here earlier
fluffypony: quit like an hour ago
mike_c: no x.eur's for sale.
pankkake: maybe there is an eur shortage
kakobrekla: ha-ha!
Naphex: kakobrekla: is there a list / help of assbot commands?
mike_c: !help
assbot: List of commands:
assbot: !up (desc: sending it via PM will voice you on chan given sufficient WOT rating)
assbot: !up <nick> (desc: sending it on chan will give <nick> voice for 30 minutes)
assbot: !ticker <exchange> <ticker> (desc: returns current ticker values, supported: MPEX, HAVELOCK, BTCTCO) {short: !t}
assbot: !last <exchange> <ticker> (desc: returns last price value, supported: MPEX, HAVELOCK, BTCTCO) {short: !l}
assbot: !mp <signcrypted dpaste.com url> (desc: returns the response from MPEX order)
assbot: !rules <nick/chan> (desc: chan guidelines) {short: !r}
assbot: !exchanges <nick/chan> (desc: lists exchanges and brokers) {short: !e}
assbot: !jd (desc: returns relevant stats from https://just-dice.com)
assbot: !bash <lines> (desc: bashes last <lines> lines to bash) {short: !b}
assbot: !quote <lines> (desc: quotes last <lines> lines and returns dpaste url) {short: !q}
kakobrekla: nooooooooo!!!111
mike_c: assbot please send donation
Naphex: ;]
kakobrekla: !help mike_c
assbot: List of commands:
assbot: !up (desc: sending it via PM will voice you on chan given sufficient WOT rating)
assbot: !up <nick> (desc: sending it on chan will give <nick> voice for 30 minutes)
assbot: !ticker <exchange> <ticker> (desc: returns current ticker values, supported: MPEX, HAVELOCK, BTCTCO) {short: !t}
assbot: !last <exchange> <ticker> (desc: returns last price value, supported: MPEX, HAVELOCK, BTCTCO) {short: !l}
assbot: !mp <signcrypted dpaste.com url> (desc: returns the response from MPEX order)
assbot: !rules <nick/chan> (desc: chan guidelines) {short: !r}
assbot: !exchanges <nick/chan> (desc: lists exchanges and brokers) {short: !e}
assbot: !jd (desc: returns relevant stats from https://just-dice.com)
assbot: !bash <lines> (desc: bashes last <lines> lines to bash) {short: !b}
assbot: !quote <lines> (desc: quotes last <lines> lines and returns dpaste url) {short: !q}
kakobrekla: doenst that work
mike_c: assbot please send two donations
Naphex: probably should reply that with privmsg/notice
Naphex: :P
kakobrekla: yes i think it does under some circumstance
Naphex: is that an eggbot? or some standalone?
mike_c: assbot has to keep up with mp's line count somehow
kakobrekla: its a thing i made many years ago Naphex
pankkake: reply in notice on !up would be nice too, because I just /msg the bot, and the reply opens a query
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17430 @ 0.00097148 = 16.9329 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 3000 @ 0.001 = 3 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 629 @ 0.001 = 0.629 BTC
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24850 @ 0.00097131 = 24.1371 BTC [-] {3}
mike_c: kakobrekla, would it be troublesome to add a primary key to http://bit4x.com/panacea/history/? seems to me there isn't a reliable way to determine uniqueness. you could very well have two trades with the same.. everything.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 800 @ 0.14 = 112 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 350 @ 0.001 = 0.35 BTC
kakobrekla: myea thats a point
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 295 @ 0.00082074 = 0.2421 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 45 @ 0.0075 = 0.3375 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 54 @ 0.00316148 = 0.1707 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 411 @ 0.00079972 = 0.3287 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14750 @ 0.00096654 = 14.2565 BTC [-]
mike_c: ;;later tell hanbot one easy way for PIF bitbets to be publicly auditable would be to use the same out address for all the bets. is that the plan?
gribble: The operation succeeded.
pankkake: *MPIF
mike_c: i can't stop calling it pif. two syllables is one too many.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 1000 @ 0.001 = 1 BTC
mike_c: BingoBoingo's is going to be hardest to track.
fluffypony: piffy?
thestringpuller: ;;seen mod6
gribble: mod6 was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 12 hours, 20 minutes, and 20 seconds ago: <mod6> thx artifexd :)
Naphex: so in my offtime i'm implementing a decent notification system in bitcoin core
Naphex: and i was getting into posting the messages and thinking
Naphex: for a first implementation do notification with:
Naphex: A. UNIX Socket / Local Socket - Connect to it, start broadcasting notifications
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 410 @ 0.001 = 0.41 BTC
Naphex: B. JSON-NP Callbacks - For easier integration with current systems
Naphex: whats that? - first look is just watch only
kakobrekla: arent you doing watch only notif
artifexd: Naphex: If you're interested, conformal's btcd already has websockets available and extending it is almost trivial.
Naphex: artifexd: thanks, but implementing this in bitcoin core.
Naphex: for the exchange i use something else entierly
Naphex: this is not related, just offtime stuff
Naphex: i wouldn't do websockets in it, too much overhead for bitcoin
artifexd: Have fun and good luck
Naphex: what's the luck for?:P
danielpbarron: what is an appropriate operating system on which to run an offline wallet?
danielpbarron: (linux -- which one?, bsd? )
thestringpuller: danielpbarron: this is where I slap you
danielpbarron: please do
thestringpuller: in all seriousness you shouldn't haven't have a full wallet on a computer
thestringpuller: generate addresses offline print them on paper
thestringpuller: send coins to the paper wallets
thestringpuller: store wallets in safety deposit boxes
thestringpuller: with backups in europe and asia
thestringpuller: maybe have your most trusted body guard/head of security hold one
danielpbarron: already do that
danielpbarron: i want to do offline transaction signing
artifexd: thestringpuller: You are describing cold storage. It sounds like danielpbarron is looking for warm storage.
danielpbarron: i want to be able to make multi-sig transactions
artifexd: Cold, warm, hot. They all have their place.
danielpbarron: unless someone can explain to me why that isn't necessary and that I'm going at this all wrong
thestringpuller: lol you want to sign a transaction offline then transmit it to the nodes whenever?
thestringpuller: isn't there trusted software for that by now?
danielpbarron: that's what i'm asking
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 134 @ 0.001 = 0.134 BTC
dexX7: hmm.. so gribble and assbot had some troubles identifying me with another nick: http://dpaste.com/1801925/
Naphex: danielpbarron: linux would be fine, but make sure you don't run other stuff
Naphex: and keep it clean and bare
danielpbarron: which distro?
Naphex: i'd go with gentoo, but whatever is fine
danielpbarron: i'm already familiar with debian based, but i've also done gentoo
Naphex: whatever you can install the cleanest
danielpbarron: gentoo was harder but much nicer when done
Naphex: make sure you use filesystem encryption as well
danielpbarron: what about the bsd variant to which MP donated
thestringpuller: freebsd?
Naphex: to ward off any physical attacks like physical hdd theft
fluffypony: OpenBSD
thestringpuller: ask mod6 bout dat
Naphex: you can use whatever you want, except windows
Naphex: but keep it clean, and only run what you need - bare
dexX7: anyway. Naphex: i did only follow the last lines, so i'm not 100 % sure, if your intention is clear to me -- if you are looking for a simple solution to establish some kind of "bitcoin based event notification system", you may use the (redirected) debug output as basis which could be parsed and processed further
danielpbarron: lol wouldn't dream of it (haven't used windows in years)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 400 @ 0.0075 = 3 BTC [+]
Naphex: firewall with blacklist everything, only whitelist what you know
Naphex: and make sure you only accept validated messages, before hitting your software
danielpbarron: not necessary right, the machine has no ethernet devices
Naphex: dexX7: yes but i want something more clear cut, that can scale
kakobrekla: dexX7 yea taht could be fixed but it would break the neatness of the design :)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14457 @ 0.00096643 = 13.9717 BTC [-] {2}
danielpbarron: or is that incase someone takes the machine and installs ethernet?
Naphex: danielpbarron: dexX7 i'm thinking like listen to a port/unix socket
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16889 @ 0.00096524 = 16.3019 BTC [-] {3}
dexX7: as source for the data?
Naphex: connect to it, and broadcast notifications through it
dexX7: aka you want to rebuild a bitcoin client?
Naphex: either that or in reverse, where it connects to a aggregate server, and that just runs pubsub
Naphex: yes i forked current master, and 0.9.1
dexX7: mind to share a link?
Naphex: its private atm, not on any service. just dirty git clone
Naphex: i will when there is something working
Naphex: even if its not final version
Naphex: but what i'm thinking is just a notification system for BitcoinD clusters, track txid's, addresses and confirmations
thestringpuller: Naphex: like what?
thestringpuller: offline wallet can't touch net even on firewall part
thestringpuller: you can't trust the TCP/IP stack
Naphex: uh, what's that related to?
Naphex: for notifications?
thestringpuller: for anything
thestringpuller: the firewall shouldn't talk to other machines with your "airgapped" software
thestringpuller: cause what you're describing is a semi-permeable airgap
dexX7: ah np, just trying to understand your approach. at which point do you fetch and process incoming information?
Naphex: thestringpuller: there are hot wallets and cold ones
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 360 @ 0.001 = 0.36 BTC
Naphex: if your hot wallet serves based on verified, signed messages, wheter HMAC or whatever, i'd say its pretty fine.
thestringpuller: depends on the transaction volume
Naphex: you trust the sig
Naphex: thestringpuller: for example, current hot wallet software
Naphex: won't accept any messages, whatever the source or trust
Naphex: if the user's OTP is not valid
Naphex: now OTP can be, Email / YubiKey -> GPG, Bitcoin signature
Naphex: now the users have that secret, so an intruder couldn't do much without user secrets
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 1 @ 0.14 BTC
Naphex: even if an attackers gets through mostly everything undetected
Naphex: its a dead end
thestringpuller: so you keep the keyring hot?
thestringpuller: that's all that matters
Naphex: only the hot wallets
Naphex: which are hot by design
thestringpuller: there is an implementation of hot wallets that don't require the key ring to touch the internet
Naphex: for incoming or outgoing?
thestringpuller: outgoing
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 193 @ 0.0013501 = 0.2606 BTC [+]
Naphex: so you want to sign transactions offline?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 540 @ 0.00135202 = 0.7301 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 1030 @ 0.001 = 1.03 BTC {2}
thestringpuller: why wouldn't you?
Naphex: why would i when i want a hot instant wallet?
thestringpuller: why do you want a hot instant wallet?
Naphex: so clients can withdraw in an instant
Naphex: they want it too
thestringpuller: this is where I rage quit like pankkake
Naphex: :))
Naphex: look, you can secure servers and keep stuff secure. now i'm not saying run everything hot
Naphex: but you can always keep i.e 10 BTC out of 1000 HOT
Naphex: and run everything else cold, you can even run deposits cold
Naphex: but wait 5mins on a withdrawal, and you're gonna get an email
Naphex: after a phone call
thestringpuller: no you're not
danielpbarron: what's more secure; using a machine that was set up before Bitcoin existed and hasn't been updated since; or a totally fresh install?
thestringpuller: mpex investors have to wait sometimes up to 24hours for withdrawals
mike_c: hm, JD seems to be down.
pankkake: thestringpuller: :o)
Naphex: thestringpuller: well thats their priviledge
Naphex: mean while, Joe Giner wants his 0.2 btc that he just bought out now
Naphex: so he can do whatever with it
thestringpuller: Joe Giner isn't worth a security breach
Naphex: maybe buy some Google Play Giftcards
pankkake: if the machine is really offline even Windows ME should be fine!
danielpbarron: what about random number generation?
pankkake: good point
Naphex: thestringpuller: honestly if you have a well designed system, that gets breached and you get ninja'd out of the 10 hotwallet BTC
Naphex: it was probably worth it
Naphex: and you can get it out of your pocket
thestringpuller: no, it wasn't
thestringpuller: MPEx has lost 0 BTC of investor funds.
thestringpuller: please direct me to another facility of such high standards.
Naphex: i haven't lost 1 satoshi yet
benkay: "yet"
Naphex: well put it like this
Naphex: the most sophisticated attacker, will need user secrets to get whatever they have
Naphex: or break HMAC-SHA256
thestringpuller: or they can dump unencrypted memory with a 0 day exploit you have no idea about yet trust your system completely
thestringpuller: because you've audited all 100% of the code oyu're running
Naphex: they can't
Naphex: server can only get clean, hard messages
Naphex: everything else gets dunked a long way from there
benkay: tbh it's an arch i'm interested in, Naphex
benkay: what does the message look like?
Naphex: MESSAGE-DATA:UUID:SIGNATURE:OTP
Naphex: for example
Naphex: TIMESTAMP/MICRO:MESSAGE-DATA:UUID:SIGNATURE:OTP
Naphex: forgot that :P
Naphex: signature is hmac-sha256 with secret, from field 1 to uuid
pankkake: you never know where security bugs are
Naphex: OTP - is otp released to the client, by levels email yubikey/gpg/ - whatever
Naphex: messages will only be fowarded by firewalls/load balancers/proxy whatever. only if valid clean message
Naphex: so lets say, max length 120, valid checksum, valid message
benkay: are you just eval'ing those funcalls when you get 'em?
Naphex: then server checks signature, then checks otp
Naphex: i have state-full firewalls that know the protocol before
Naphex: and they check and validate the protocol and messages before
Naphex: just to make sure they are clean, and no 0 day can travell till the end
mike_c: mpex actually did lose some investor funds according to rota :)
thestringpuller: mike_c: good point ;) man that was a long time ago
asciilifeform: gotta ask, what's the basis for trusting 'yubikey' ?
Naphex: asciilifeform: i trust them mostly, but the security level is chosen by the client. so if client trusts yubi, then it trusts yubi validation servers
Naphex: i will soon be implementing GPG OTP
Naphex: so there
asciilifeform: the hardware.
asciilifeform: afaik - as closed as it gets
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 2.70729420 BTC to 7`514 shares, 36030 satoshi per share
Naphex: i'd recommend the system over gauth
Naphex: and you don't have to keep the secret keys for it
asciilifeform: Naphex: what can we tell from this marketing brochure?
asciilifeform: i see no description of the internals.
Naphex: of the hardware?
asciilifeform: correct
Naphex: doubt their open
asciilifeform: they're not.
Naphex: but the software is, and there are some yubi software generators around
thestringpuller: what's the point of 2 factor?
asciilifeform: the hardware makes a promise.
asciilifeform: we cannot see if the promise is kept
jurov: thestringpuller: mpex did lose few bitcoins due to human errors, don't paint mp as saint
jurov: manual process does have disavantages, too
thestringpuller: true but far less than say bitcoinica
Naphex: i use a yubikey neo, and i'm pretty happy with it
Naphex: i don't place maxtrust on it
Naphex: but it's a level above
Naphex: don't place maxtrust(TM) on anything though :)
asciilifeform: it's never a question of 'maxtrust'
asciilifeform: for instance, what measures, if any, against 'differential power analysis' in yubikey?
asciilifeform: the closed aspect suggests, 'none'
jurov: thestringpuller: burnside (of btct) trolled coinbr hard, because mpex keys are online
jurov: but they must be somehow online for ppl to be able to trade
thestringpuller: offline/online
benkay: fluffypony: you missed the conversation where we mocked sfi for just listing a bunch of other people's projects on their havelock page.
thestringpuller: sorry misreading your sentence
pankkake: well, GPG allows you to be partially online
fluffypony: benkay: yeah the whole thing is a joke
Naphex: asciilifeform: are you sugesting DPA could be use in retriving yubikey secret?
pankkake: unless it signs with the main key
Naphex: which you would need to generate a valid otp
asciilifeform: Naphex: for instance.
fluffypony: benkay: did you see their reply to my TagPesa questions? they're all shock and horror that I suggested that institutional investors and even casual observers aren't impressed with them
kakobrekla: mike_c : http://bit4x.com/panacea/history/ < dis ok? note the csv url is different nao
benkay: i saw something to the effect in the logs. tbqf i don't in2 drama.
asciilifeform: a closed gadget suggests that there is something to be gained from learning what has been kept closed.
mike_c: kakobrekla: perfect, thanks.
Naphex: Having discovered the security problem, before publication, we contacted the
asciilifeform: there we go.
Naphex: vendor Yubico as mentioned before. Yubico acknowledged our results and has
Naphex: taken measures to mitigate the security issues. We examined an updated firmware
Naphex: (version 2.4) and found that our attacks do not apply to this improved version.
Naphex: so yeah they had to tape the button
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9573 @ 0.0009692 = 9.2782 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: interesting lack of detail about vendor's response.
Naphex: there is a response bit more down
Naphex: something about NEO and STANDARD were unaffected because OATH
asciilifeform: that's a response?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 405 @ 0.001 = 0.405 BTC
Naphex: guess so, still.. you'd still need the button pressed
Naphex: or taped
Naphex: so a backdoor /trojan wouldn't get it without a huge sample size
Naphex: i'm not trumpeting yubikey, but i don't know of a better OTP atm
asciilifeform: nothing to do with trojans
asciilifeform: the device comes with not one but two gestures of bad faith
asciilifeform: i.e. - close,
asciilifeform: and undertakes to solve a problem to which there can be no solution
asciilifeform: *closed
Naphex: well, i just use it as a solution for OTP without handling private keys
asciilifeform: you're still handling private keys
Naphex: for GAuth you gotta transport the secret to the user
asciilifeform: just in a box
asciilifeform: that is decorated with alchemical symbols, in order to seem impenetrable to naive buyer
Naphex: you're not handling the private keys since you can just check yubico servers
asciilifeform: you gotta transport the secret to the user << did i wake up today in a parallel universe where public-key crypto was never invented ?
Naphex: you only need client's pubkey
Naphex: asciilifeform: still protecting Gauth secret ruins the whole point
Naphex: if i have to deliver DH/GPG secret to the client for GAuth
Naphex: to just have it on the phone / or cached or who knows what
Naphex: i'd just stop ther eand request gpg auth:P
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3572 @ 0.0009692 = 3.462 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: take minute to think, what is yubi hiding, when refusing to publish the design ?
Naphex unplugs yubikey out :)
Naphex: well - a completly open OTP token, with hardware for sale would make a killin'
Naphex: i'd buy one
Naphex: ;;rate 1 asciilifeform NSA Should make a open OTP Token ;]
gribble: Error: Spurious "]". You may want to quote your arguments with double quotes in order to prevent extra brackets from being evaluated as nested commands.
Naphex: ;;rate 1 asciilifeform NSA Should make a open OTP Token
gribble: Error: 'asciilifeform' is not a valid integer.
Naphex: psh
Naphex: ;;rate asciilifeform 1 NSA Should make a open OTP Token
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating of 1 for user asciilifeform has been recorded.
Naphex: noob me, forgeting syntax
kakobrekla: Naphex forget it, he is busy with the sub
pankkake: ;;rate asciilifeform 1 makes the best tinfoil hats
gribble: Rating entry successful. Your rating for user asciilifeform has changed from 1 to 1.
asciilifeform: Naphex: 'cardano' could in principle be used as 'token.' but you gotta understand the difference between what yubi promises and what honest people can actually physically achieve
asciilifeform: ed felten's words, 'try to make a safe that can be left in burglar's living room' sums up the issue
benkay: what does yubi nominally promise?
asciilifeform: benkay: it promises that a private key can be sent in the post, left plugged in at wiring closet, etc. without danger.
benkay: hue
benkay: I WOULD LIKE A CARDANO PLZ
diametric: me too
Naphex: for me it promises a OTP, from the user. which i can validate without holding a secret
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 32 @ 0.00709698 = 0.2271 BTC [-] {5}
asciilifeform: Naphex: what i'm trying to get across is that a fellow with yubikey in his pocket is, in fact, 'holding a secret'
Naphex: and OTP just removes the risk of insider/intrusion that can just spam hotwallet servers or trade messages with withdrawals
asciilifeform: even if a con artist has fooled him into thinking otherwise
Naphex: asciilifeform: i'm talking from a server end point, i don't have to keep user secret. just public key
Naphex: so user gives me yubi pub key, and then shoots OTP
Naphex: i validate OTP against yubiservers
asciilifeform: since no one groks, looks like i'll have to 'draw a picture.'
asciilifeform: extraction of yubi internal key by the postman isn't the only interesting scenario
asciilifeform: vendor has the key.
asciilifeform: does he need to? the way it is designed - yes
artifexd: If it makes a difference, yubikey's internal slots are client writable.
Naphex: true, but my risk is still reduced, that an attacker/breacher would have to have private keys leaked, have user secrets, and have user email, and penetrate hard within infrastructure without detection, to nab some satoshi from the hot wallet
asciilifeform: likewise, given closed design, user has no way of knowing if yubi tosses a few bits of key into each signature nonce
benkay: can't vet the thing's behavior, artifexd. might as well be squirting things written to those slots back home.
Naphex: some risk reduction is worth it, even if not bulletproof in all theoretical/practical/NSA cases
asciilifeform: you don't need an army and navy to pwn yubi users. just a little bit of cooperation from the vendor.
Naphex: at least some 0 day or insider, or whatever breaches deep enough to issue withdrawal messages
asciilifeform: in that respect, it is exactly like other seekoority snake oil products.
Naphex: it still needs that stuff to do damage
artifexd: The point was that, instead of reading the key, an attacker could put his own key in there since he supposedly has access to the device prior to the client getting it. Also, the client could generate and insert is own keys thus destroying the attacker's advantage.
Naphex: you don't have to go that deep
artifexd: That may, or may not, invalidate the ability to use yubikey's servers though. I don't know.
asciilifeform: all of the traditional crapola is present. enforced and perpetual dependence on the vendor, for example.
kakobrekla: gox loaded yubis with their keys so the keys were locked to gox use only
Naphex: you can just realtime phish or sniff/block otp
Naphex: but that attack needs to be targeted
Naphex: and gox had the keys
asciilifeform: fact is, any secret key generated outside of your home should be assumed to be in enemy hands at birth.
Naphex: of course
benkay: all of a sudden i'm struck by the notion that the only good withdrawal message is one gpg-signed by the withdrawing party.
Naphex: said signer can still leak his keyphrase and key
Naphex: so..
benkay: not holding party's problem, though.
asciilifeform: yubi, by all indications, is designed to resist any attempt to determine whether it leaks key. therefore i must assume that it does.
artifexd: benkay If the yubikey registers as a keyboard, how can it access the network?
artifexd: It can certainly be loaded on an airgapped machine.
Naphex: artifexd: you touch the button, it types the OTP
artifexd: Yeah. I have several.
Naphex: ah sorry, i missread
artifexd: benkay suggested that the yubikey could phone home (or any attacker) with the new contents if it were reloaded. I was questioning that.
Naphex: ah, i doubt it. unless their personalization tool phones home, but doubt that
benkay: artifexd: i don't know enough about the thing. it pretends to be a keyboard, though? sounds like a lot of unexaminable dependencies.
artifexd: And even if it did, run it on an airgapped machine.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20383 @ 0.0009692 = 19.7552 BTC [+]
benkay: so yubi is a signing thing? what are these yubi servers an implementer talks to?
benkay: it sounds weird and i don't trust it.
benkay: contrast with transparency of...gnu privacy guard.
artifexd: Similar to the transparency of... openssl?
benkay: bedrock of public crypto...known shitburger. great comparison.
artifexd: Open source compared to open source. The point is that being open doesn't make something trustworthy.
benkay: however being closed does make a thing impossible to trust.
benkay: this goes back to the problem of trust in the wot. openssl, pirate...ask anyone who knows things what they think of the two.
benkay: hey, guys: which is less likely to leak? openssl or gpg?
benkay: the comparison is not made on the basis of openness, rather by asking professionals and the experienced what their opinions are and why they are that.
Naphex: for me its still about risk reduction
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.06566806 = 0.197 BTC [-] {2}
Naphex: attacker needs username, password, otp(yubi,gpg), email for approving a withdrawal
thestringpuller: Naphex: i can get all three by putting a gun to the customer's head
pankkake: you couldn't, I don't have my passwords
Naphex: sure. if you get all 4 the only thing that can save you is hope you don't hit any short-circuits or be enough in the hot wallet
Naphex: :P
Naphex: maybe i can ask an emergency question?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3400 @ 0.00096938 = 3.2959 BTC [+]
Naphex: and only one right answer, if you put in wrong answer we helicopter and save you
thestringpuller: why not consolidate all 4 to gpg
Naphex: you can set some really abstract question
Naphex: thestringpuller: i am, i will be adding GPG auth. but thats it
Naphex: we are planning on reaching regular folks as well
Naphex: not just the crypto community
Naphex: but we will be adding some nice UX for GPG authentication
Naphex: and doing some tutorial video for setting up, for noobs
Naphex: so there's that
Naphex: https://www.btcxchange.ro/order - its meant to have some easyability in it, remember it's an exchange and we will be having a transaction fee at some point
ozbot: btcXchange.ro - The first Bitcoin exchange in Romania
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23850 @ 0.00096914 = 23.114 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 3000 @ 0.001 = 3 BTC
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6500 @ 0.00097105 = 6.3118 BTC [+] {2}
Duffer1: sf2? oh lawd another one?
mike_c: there are so many good companies for them to invest in! they need more funds.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF1] 200 @ 0.000835 = 0.167 BTC [+] {2}
Duffer1: incredible
Naphex: BTCTrip is nice and works well
fluffypony: Naphex: that's the exception to the rule
fluffypony: it's actually a completed product
fluffypony: have you seen TagPesa's pitch deck?
fluffypony: or BiTnews
Naphex: nah, the rest look like bull
ozbot: Operators | Ignite Financing
Naphex: rly
thestringpuller: ;;google major tom venture bros.
gribble: Major Tom | The Venture Bros. | Adult Swim - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-aqvIU1dkD8>; Major Tom - The Venture Bros. Wiki - The People's Republic of ...: <http://venturefans.org/vbwiki/Major_Tom>; Ghosts of the Sargasso - The Venture Bros. Wiki - The People's ...: <http://venturefans.org/vbwiki/Ghosts_of_the_Sargasso>
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16071 @ 0.00097275 = 15.6331 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11154 @ 0.00097436 = 10.868 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.50188389 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 50 @ 0.0045 = 0.225 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 41 @ 0.00453622 = 0.186 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33288 @ 0.00097529 = 32.4655 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2 @ 0.067799 = 0.1356 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6600 @ 0.00096973 = 6.4002 BTC [-] {2}
benkay: !up steven-__
assbot: Voicing steven-__ for 30 minutes.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 850 @ 0.14 = 119 BTC
jurov: !up belcher
assbot: Voicing belcher for 30 minutes.
jurov: !up MiningBuddy
assbot: Voicing MiningBuddy for 30 minutes.
jurov: !up dR3
assbot: Voicing dR3 for 30 minutes.
dR3: Greets all. Appreciate this chan. That is all =)
jurov: :)
jurov looks whether SF1 paid any divs ..nope
jurov: so not one of their startups is profitable yet.nice
thestringpuller: they are gonna show us howt hey run this show
thestringpuller: HOW THEY RUN IT INTO THE GROUND
mike_c: they got their mistakes out of the way with SF1. You need to jump on SF2, it's going to the moon.
thestringpuller: i'd rather put money in mpif
thestringpuller: or just make equal high weight bets on boths sides of a bit bet...
jurov: that's ridiculous
fluffypony: who needs dividends, jurov?
fluffypony: investors should just throw money at it
jurov: SFI unit holders are entitled to receive dividends indirectly from the Fund's startups which have a
jurov: dividend distribution plan.
jurov: how indirectly?
jurov: guess the dividend plans are guarded with utmost secrecy :D
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 15 @ 0.067799 = 1.017 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: ;;later tell mircea_popescu my hunch is that all known block ciphers have non-linear keyspaces.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
jurov: asciilifeform: care to elaborate?
asciilifeform: ;;google nonlinear keyspace
gribble: Weak key - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weak_key>; hybrid message-embedded cipher using logistic map - arXiv: <http://arxiv.org/pdf/1209.2582>; State convergence and keyspace reduction of the Mixer stream cipher: <http://eprint.iacr.org/2010/628.pdf>
jurov: so you suspect AES for certain keys is more easily crackable? how so?
asciilifeform: jurov: this notion is not original to me, visit the literature
jurov: because it was never proven otherwise? i can see that
midnightmagic: history of past bad keyspace means attackers try that first always
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22700 @ 0.0009754 = 22.1416 BTC [+] {3}
midnightmagic: (aside from weak keygen)
BingoBoingo: mike_c: It will be harder to track my part of MPIF, but the monthly statements will still exist, and there's the part where at least at the start of this the operation I am running is smaller than the other portions.
mike_c: it would be feasible to have a webpage showing your balances. that is perhaps not a good idea for a market maker though.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31991 @ 0.00097572 = 31.2143 BTC [+] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 4 @ 0.0742218 = 0.2969 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 4 @ 0.034 = 0.136 BTC [-]
BingoBoingo: mike_c: Well, the monthly reports will include exact balances, but I'm not yet sure about the wisdom of offering balances in real time. That might leak things like when exactly trades executed and where I had orders sitting on the orderbook.
mike_c: yeah. definitely a balancing act with how visible it should be.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 3 @ 0.034 = 0.102 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 3 @ 0.0406 = 0.1218 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 3 @ 0.0742218 = 0.2227 BTC [-]
fluffypony: "Due to popular demand, now available to trade on an easier to use system. Available here https://bitcoinbourse.eu/ ticker DUN"
fluffypony: well that's the end of that
jurov: lulzbourse is easy to use????
jurov: the interface is rather chaotic
jurov: and all orders expire in 3 days
fluffypony: jurov: well you also don't have to do anything to list
jurov: so you have to log in every 3 days if you want to maintain standing order
fluffypony: except say "I want to list"
fluffypony: in fact
fluffypony: I'd hazard it's easier to list there than on MasterCoin
jurov: oh i misunderstood... easy to use system for an issuer, not for the user
moiety: my client was flashing when i got in, not sure if it was because moiety or manuls was mentioned
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 577 @ 0.001 = 0.577 BTC
moiety: ;; later tell mircea_popescu even the doges are at it now http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/2014-04/enhanced/webdr04/25/10/enhanced-buzz-22480-1398437911-8.jpg must be for cinco de mayo
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 1 @ 0.14 BTC
fluffypony: have to show my wife that
fluffypony: moiety: I mentioned manuls
pankkake: lol a hilight on manuls
moiety: alongside moiety... so im unsure which triggered smuxi to flash
moiety: hi pankkake :D
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: Do you worry that maybe your wife might begin to suspect you might be spending all of this time online trying to cheat on her with a Manul?
moiety: that would obviously be forgiven as soon as she looked up manuls?
moiety: also herroo BB :D
asciilifeform: fly manul to argentina, breed with colocolo -> double thickness
moiety: you are a genius
diametric: asciilifeform: hows mainboard development going?
asciilifeform: diametric: had to switch to 4-layer.
asciilifeform: diametric: something that i was hoping to avoid
diametric: damn
moiety: i tried to rewire a mouse today, didnt go so well
pankkake: a manul ate it?
moiety: unfortunately not. i tried to frankenstein the usb bit on the end with a non frayed one. i ended up with more bits than i started with D;
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: we have 6 dogs
fluffypony: she knows I would never
moiety: the hattori is a bit more vicious on little wires than i was expecting
BingoBoingo: fluffypony: All it takes is 1 Manul and then you have 0 dogs
moiety: ^ this
fluffypony: we have Basenjis
fluffypony: they'll take a Manul on
moiety: oh wow they dont bark do they
fluffypony: they yodel
moiety: yodelling dogs!
moiety: i know the ones!
moiety: they are corgi coloured BB but legs are like 5 times the length
BingoBoingo: They look like malnourished strays
fluffypony: BingoBoingo: lol
moiety: just because youre used to seeing fat assed corgis
moiety: you would be horrified at greyhounds
fluffypony: they're one of the ancient breeds, so they're the dogs in ancient egypt that the pharoahs worshipped
asciilifeform: basenji - that looks quite like the dogs i saw in Timis.
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: The basenji is basically a pariah dog type. What other dogs revert to after uncontrolled breeding. Natural strays.
fluffypony: if you lock a bunch of dogs on an island
fluffypony: say, Australia
fluffypony: and come back in 100 years
fluffypony: you'll have an island of Basenjis
jurov: !up justusranvier
assbot: Voicing justusranvier for 30 minutes.
jurov: !up mius
assbot: Voicing mius for 30 minutes.
BingoBoingo: 'They were developed as a water rescue/lifesaving dog, but according to O. Krasnovskaya, "That was not a good idea as [they] were not willing to save drowning people, but mostly were looking to bite them so this breed was never developed".'
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 2 @ 0.0742218 = 0.1484 BTC [-]
Naphex: sounds in tune with youtube russia :)
Naphex: gn
moiety: rhodesian ridgeback is an interesting dog imo
BingoBoingo: just because it hunts lions, doesn't mean it will be effective against a Manul though.
moiety: night Naphex sleep well :]
moiety: nothing is effective against a manul!
fluffypony: moiety: except a pack of Basenjis!
moiety: well, you have a pack.... shall we experiment?
moiety: BB start the BitBet nao!
moiety: put your bitcoins where your basenjis are fluffypony :P
moiety bets on manuls
fluffypony: moiety I would
fluffypony: I don't want to be responsible for a dead manul
moiety: dead happy manul*
moiety: dead = very in scotland
fluffypony: moiety here
ozbot: Basenji fight - Imgur
fluffypony: that's what happens when the beta picks a fight with the alpha
fluffypony: (the beta lost, he's the one with the bust up eye)
atcbot: [X-BT] Bid: 156 Ask: 238 Last Price: 200 24h-Vol: 978k High: 230 Low: 150 VWAP: 184
mircea_popescu: so how was the difficulty ?
mod6: %diff
atcbot: [ATC Diff] Current Diff: 455357.13 Est. Next Diff: 174611.14 in 1931 blocks (#32256) Est. % Change: -61.65
ozbot: 6.979 billion | Next Diff in 180 blocks | Estimated Change: 14.5004% in 1d 1h 20m 11s
moiety: fluffypony: wow what a shame D;
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 455357.13 / 6.979 / 10**9
gribble: 6.5246758848e-05
mircea_popescu: 0.00006524 by diff.
fluffypony: moiety: yeah, they belong to the "fight to the death" school of pack leadership :-P
moiety: fluffypony: like hamsters
fluffypony: there we go
fluffypony: giant, yodelling hamsters
moiety: XD bahahahahaha
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform its probable yubikeys have a master, yes.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: not only this, but they write the key. ergo, they have the key.
asciilifeform: somehow this concept is 'rocket surgery' to people.
fluffypony: it's still a sight better than "password + birthday = secure password"
asciilifeform: may as well say that it beats being dragged behind a truck until nothing remains on the rope but a tattered thread of skin.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform> you gotta transport the secret to the user << did i wake up today in a parallel universe where public-key crypto was never invented ? << no, you woke up in a parallel universe where microsoft is still a business model.
mircea_popescu: not THAT paralel.
mircea_popescu: <Naphex> asciilifeform: i'm talking from a server end point, i don't have to keep user secret. just public key <<< see, there. that's the value proposition : it allows the operator to say "sorry, fuck you" to the user in terms that are socially acceptable,
mircea_popescu: unlike the bitbet style, which while being exactly the same thing, is socially unacceptable.
mircea_popescu: artifexd> That may, or may not, invalidate the ability to use yubikey's servers though. I don't know. << afaik blowing their key does make it unable to use the servers, because you see, the true beauty of stupidty : they actually narrow the keyspace (significantly) to make their product vendor-lockedin
mircea_popescu: ie, not all keys work, key has to satisfy magic yubikey criteria on top of entropy
pankkake: oh was that why the mtgox keys worked only with mtgox?
mircea_popescu: <benkay> all of a sudden i'm struck by the notion that the only good withdrawal message is one gpg-signed by the withdrawing party. << welcome to... 2012 ?
mircea_popescu: pankkake yup.
artifexd: The code to run a yubikey server is open source so you, I, or anyone is welcome to swap out the key and run their own server.
mircea_popescu: they used same principle, except (afaik) even shittier implementation
mircea_popescu: reduced space even more
pankkake: that's like the password things that require you to have "at least one number, one capitalized letter, one symbol"
mircea_popescu: kinda worse, tbh
mircea_popescu: <benkay> hey, guys: which is less likely to leak? openssl or gpg? << gpg may still have a bug or two in there.
mircea_popescu: <Naphex> we are planning on reaching regular folks as well << tbh, as long as you ernestly offer the strong version, nobody can hold it against you that you also offer a convenient version.
mircea_popescu: as long as the user can choose, you're scott free.
mircea_popescu: <mike_c> they got their mistakes out of the way with SF1. You need to jump on SF2, it's going to the moon. << i forget, what was the eventual return on that thing ?
mircea_popescu: <midnightmagic> (aside from weak keygen) << and aside from planted holes.
mike_c: sf1 stock is down 15% from ipo in december, no dividends.
mike_c: so not bad for havelol
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 18 @ 0.03447 = 0.6205 BTC [+] {6}
fluffypony: mike_c: I'd love to know what they're going to do since GoCoin rejected their investment
fluffypony: so now they have this pile of BTC that was meant for GoCoin
fluffypony: or OkPay
fluffypony: or whatever it's called
mike_c: i'm sure they will find someone willing to take it.
fluffypony: GoCoin
ozbot: Seedcoin Fund I Update: No GoCoin, What Next?
mircea_popescu: today i learned Basenji is a sort of dog.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 9 @ 0.03447 = 0.3102 BTC [+] {4}
mircea_popescu: o wow all caught up with log. check me out!
mircea_popescu does a little all caught up dance.
mircea_popescu: mike_c ah, almost worse than dr foreskin
mircea_popescu: fluffypony they'll buy virtual mining shares.
fluffypony: hah hah
mircea_popescu: this concept where they return the investment is obviously too much for teh forum.
artifexd: mircea_popescu: What is the way in which purchasers of f.mpif are expecting to make money? Increase in nav? Dividends?
pankkake: my last encounter with jimmothy points to that :/
mircea_popescu: artifexd well substantially, my thinking is that one does not simply kill berkshire, one also makes a replacement. if one's polite, at least.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 900 @ 0.14 = 126 BTC
mircea_popescu: so in general, the share should appreciate through tracking its nav.
artifexd: That implies that you do not expect to issue regular dividends. Correct?
mircea_popescu: dividends will happen if there's no rational use of capital comensurate with historical gains, so if the thing makes ~10% pa for a while, and there's no way to beat that, i'd start distributing capital
pankkake: it's in the blog post iirc
mircea_popescu: artifexd correct. it even says as much.
mircea_popescu: " It may pay a dividend during any period I determine this expedient, but there is no promise of monthly dividend (nor does such a thing make any sense whatsoever, for most companies)."
artifexd: Well. Crap. I hate asking questions when the answer is in black and white.
mircea_popescu: eh no big deal, you don't have a charged history.
mircea_popescu: everyone can get away with a few.
pankkake: no one should be blamed for tl;dring trilema
mircea_popescu: anyway : because i actually included pc5 explicitly, the share actually has a clear mechanism to track nav pretty closely.
mircea_popescu: this i personally regard as a structural and significant improvement over berkshire.
fluffypony: hah hah pankkake
pankkake: there's no public nav for berkshire?
fluffypony: I normally have to gloss over Trilema posts 5 or 6 times before I remember what it was about
Namworld: Returning the investment is not something that the forum can digest you say? So if I complete repaying all my lenders, all hell will break loose on the forum?
fluffypony: Namworld: I think the world will come to the end
mircea_popescu: pankkake eh i wouldn't go as far as that
pankkake: fluffypony: I'll eventually make a script to put them on my ereader. maybe I'll read them all then
mircea_popescu: Namworld in a word, yes.
mircea_popescu: pankkake see, the problem is you don't fly enough.
Namworld: Seems like a good reason to not give up then.
mircea_popescu: i know at least a dozen people who read trilema while travelling. catch up with a month's worth on an intercontinental flight
pankkake: I have had some productivity streaks while on the train
pankkake: that's actually why I don't mind long *comfortable* travel over short inconfortable
mircea_popescu: btw, what's the worst time to have a productive streak ?
fluffypony: on the toilet
mircea_popescu: when you're riding a bird.
pankkake: I usually solve problems when peeing
mircea_popescu: (scottish bird = girl)
mircea_popescu: btw, what's with the brony power puff nick ?
mircea_popescu: faghaters were inquiring earlier.
fluffypony: oh I saw that in the log
fluffypony: ok so when I was young, maybe 22 or 23
mrstickball: 100% APY
mircea_popescu: "this one time, in band camp..."
mrstickball: pretty vague stuff, wondering if its a ponzi
fluffypony: I worked at this IT company, and there were these two cute sales girls (literally the only two decent looking people at the company)
fluffypony: and they were known as fluffy puppy and fluffy bunny
fluffypony: never asked why
fluffypony: at any rate, we went on a team building weekend away
fluffypony: got slaughter-house drunk with them whilst the nerds went to sleep
fluffypony: and they decided to give me a nick name
mircea_popescu: before or after the oral sex ?
fluffypony: so in the wee hours of a debaucherus night/morning they decided my nick name would be fluffy horse
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: inbetween and all around
artifexd: Isn't that known as "fluffing"?
fluffypony: artifexd: that came up as part of the convo that night ;)
mircea_popescu: is this story a subtle suggestion you've got a nigger hose ?
fluffypony: mircea_popescu: *wink*
fluffypony: anyway, I thought fluffy horse "sounded gay"
mircea_popescu: don't wink at me, i don't twink that way
fluffypony: and they thought "fluffy pony" was much better
fluffypony: which was "lol funny joke"
mircea_popescu: lol o i c, fluffy pony is less gay. right. what'd you drink, paint thinner ?
pankkake: maybe in an ironic way
fluffypony: till they started calling me fluffypony and FP in emails and at Friday afternoon drinks
fluffypony: and it stuck
mircea_popescu: well cool story brony.
mircea_popescu: glad i asked.
fluffypony: well it's better than some of my nicknames in the 90s
fluffypony: I think I was death-0ver0rd on Dalnet for like a year
mircea_popescu: artifexd fluffing is when a youngish girl that aspires to one day make money from porn tries her inept damdest to get up the overworked penis of some druggie pronstar guy
fluffypony: *shudders*
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 12 @ 0.06750616 = 0.8101 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 250 @ 0.001 = 0.25 BTC
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 25 @ 0.0075 = 0.1875 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20086 @ 0.00097079 = 19.4993 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 20 @ 0.00554001 = 0.1108 BTC [-]
jurov: mrstickball, you can inquire Mr. Miquel J. Pavón Besalú for lulz if you want provided you publish the convo,
ozbot: B of A math error halts dividend increase | America's Markets
mircea_popescu: check tghis shit out.
jurov: i'll give you his addy
mrstickball: do you know anything about him, or are you just asking me to PM him and post convo for lulz? jurov
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.034 = 0.17 BTC [-]
jurov: he asked me to list HFLTC on coinbr
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26247 @ 0.00097351 = 25.5517 BTC [+] {2}
mrstickball: I saw that he was looking at listing on Coin Brouse, but was unsure how that interaction worked
jurov: he is there
mrstickball: so he wanted to use coinbr to get on mPEX?
jurov: i preferred not to ask, sent him straight to read trilema
jurov: that fell to deaf ears
mrstickball: odd that he believes that he wants to invest as a hedge fund but not read up on exchanges..
mircea_popescu: numerisTrade answered your comments.
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: are most romania young ladies hot?
thestringpuller: seems like Romania is the new Brazil
mircea_popescu: they're hungry and they walk a lot.
mircea_popescu: it helps.
jurov: !up ericmuyser
assbot: Voicing ericmuyser for 30 minutes.
jurov: !up jborkl
assbot: Voicing jborkl for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: !jd mpif
assbot: Current MPIF account balance on Just-Dice: 50.24168916 BTC
mircea_popescu: hey where's my 7% a week
mrstickball: I thought Romania was the poor man's Poland, which is the poor man's GDR
jurov: lol such stereotype heaping
thestringpuller: did ReutersEmily ever make an mpex article?
mircea_popescu: not afaik.
mircea_popescu: i imagine if she did she'd have come back and dropped a line
thestringpuller: I'm reading up on the march 21st logs, just wondering what came of the IRC interview.
benkay: <BingoBoingo> fluffypony: All it takes is 1 Manul and then you have 0 doges << ftfy
benkay: manul for atc mascot?
benkay: !up blackwhite_
assbot: Voicing blackwhite_ for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: is it like an altcat ?
benkay: better than a lolcat
benkay: not quite the dragon of btc
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller since then we've had another reuters chick recently
benkay: was there a recursive bitbet recently?
thestringpuller: are there logs there?
thestringpuller: lemme just google
thestringpuller: benkay: recursive bet?
benkay: not necessarily recently
thestringpuller: ;;gettrust Ukyo
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user thestringpuller to user Ukyo: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=thestringpuller&dest=Ukyo | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=Ukyo | Rated since: never
benkay: something like 'this bet resolves as yes if there's more yes than no'
thestringpuller: ;;gettrust utko
benkay: more btc bet on yes i mean
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user thestringpuller to user utko: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=thestringpuller&dest=utko | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=utko | Rated since: never
thestringpuller: ;;gettrust ukto
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user thestringpuller to user ukto: Level 1: 0, Level 2: -4 via 3 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=thestringpuller&dest=ukto | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=ukto | Rated since: Wed Jun 15 00:24:56 2011
mircea_popescu: ;;google site:log.bitcoin-assets.com "pura vida"
fluffypony: oh well that's helpful
mircea_popescu: google is like a paragon of useless.
benkay: submit to the personalization, mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller Apr 23 05:03:11
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: jesus google has gotten good meanwhile ?! << haha mircea_popescu has a love hate relationship with google
benkay: <mike_c> sf1 stock is down 15% from ipo in december, no dividends.
dub: has s.mpif a blogsplanation?
mircea_popescu: yeah. actual hate and ironic love.
benkay: ;;google trilema wunderbar spif
gribble: No matches found.
benkay: ;;google trilema wunderbar mpif
gribble: The wunderbar S.MPIF pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/2014/the-wunderbar-smpif/>; Economic cycles finally explained pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea ...: <http://trilema.com/2014/economic-cycles-finally-explained/>; Gloria pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/2014/gloria/>
mircea_popescu: benkay weird how that works huh
mircea_popescu: ;;google trilema wunderbar smpif
gribble: The wunderbar S.MPIF pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/2014/the-wunderbar-smpif/>
mircea_popescu: ;;google trilema smpif
gribble: The wunderbar S.MPIF pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/2014/the-wunderbar-smpif/>
mircea_popescu: ;;google smpif
gribble: The wunderbar S.MPIF pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: <http://trilema.com/2014/the-wunderbar-smpif/>; The Legend of Malin Kundang by Muthy - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4IPjMv1Zef0>; PV#1 Light Novel Indonesia "TOP IDOL!" - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DRKmyeXj6s>
dub: oh yeah I think I read that after 24 hours travel
thestringpuller: AH one from Central mexico
benkay: <fluffypony> I worked at this IT company, and there were these two cute sales girls (literally the only two decent looking people at the company) << including you?
fluffypony: benkay: pretty much, I've never claimed to be beautiful
fluffypony: my wife certainly didn't marry me for my looks
mircea_popescu: the only thing about him is the way that he walks.
mircea_popescu: he can't even dance.
fluffypony: heh heh
fluffypony: hot sun, beating down, burning my feet just walkin' around
mircea_popescu: my black stony heart is so satisfied today.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 60 @ 0.00445035 = 0.267 BTC [-]
thestringpuller: so web of trust I think gets more accurate over time
mircea_popescu: this romanian party, was ruling party. a year or so ago i quit, and quite publicly told them to either bring me the head of the then-president or else there will be no fucking party.
mircea_popescu: they just split, lost the government, are probably going straight to the history books.
fluffypony: poetic justice
mircea_popescu: ah, the sweet pleasure of the utter destruction of schmucks that thought they knew better
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller that'd be accurate
thestringpuller: well i've been doing gettrust on known scammers
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 5 @ 0.03447 = 0.1724 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: the WoT blatantly says "Nigga don't trust these guys"
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller actually i would imagine its accuracy is a linear function of the average length of noncircular paths.
moiety: fluffypony: aww! i wonder if they followed on land too!
thestringpuller: hmm, paths that have definite endpoints?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13236 @ 0.00097011 = 12.8404 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: moiety chicks only follow you the way they wanted to go anyway :D
fluffypony: hah hah
mircea_popescu: thestringpuller paths that include any given segment at most once
mircea_popescu: (segment = direct path between two nodes)
thestringpuller: Ah I see.
thestringpuller: So that would mean the more connections the more accurate?
thestringpuller: or would that just be a side-effect of what you're describing
mircea_popescu: the "deeper" connections
moiety: <mircea_popescu> my black stony heart is so satisfied today. << what did you eat?!
moiety: pasta is good for the soul :]
mircea_popescu: i'm the grandmaster of white sauces.
asciilifeform: anyone here own 'yubikey' ? got it to cough up its fw?
benkay: !up blackwhite_
assbot: Voicing blackwhite_ for 30 minutes.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: looks like it only mentions the server-end crap
artifexd: asciilifeform: I have one that I'm willing to sacrifice to the cause but I have no idea how to do that.
mircea_popescu: "- The Yubikey personalization app saves a .csv logfile with the programmed key values meaning a malware-based attack may discover the log files on block devices even when the files have been deleted"
artifexd: I'd be willing to mail it to you if that would be useful.
mircea_popescu: artifexd only after he finishes the cardano
asciilifeform: artifexd: sadly, i'm otherwise occupied. but you are encouraged to do it yourself
asciilifeform: note that yubi is braindamaged even if there is no obvious flaw in the hardware
asciilifeform: (see log)
asciilifeform: just boggles me mind that people swallow this shit.
moiety: i think you should send me some sauce so i can test this statement mircea_popescu
mircea_popescu: a no, gotta wear a steel collar to be tasting this thing.
kakobrekla: asciilifeform its not like its cake or death dilemma
moiety: i was shown those neokey things a while ago
asciilifeform: 'we're all out of death, gonna have to be cake'
moiety: lol fair enough mircea_popescu
fluffypony: asciilifeform: he is by far my favourite comedian
benkay: !up coingenuity
assbot: Voicing coingenuity for 30 minutes.
benkay: what's up coingenuity
benkay: SUCH PUN
benkay: !up mikaeldice
assbot: Voicing mikaeldice for 30 minutes.
mikaeldice: Hi benkay
benkay: hi mikaeldice what's news?
mikaeldice: Nothing new.. I've been wondering for a while if there is a better forum than bitcointalk, though.
benkay: just irc
benkay: the log
benkay: and blogs
fluffypony: bitcointa.lk is much better
mircea_popescu: benkay that pun took me three passes.
benkay: just another dumpun. don't break yourself.
thestringpuller: ;;seen alexsanjose
gribble: alexsanjose was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 5 days, 19 hours, 12 minutes, and 36 seconds ago: <alexsanjose> if you come across in humans in Central America who have bitcoin gambling operations and they want to talk to a reporter, tell them i dont bite alexandra.alper@thomsonreuters.com
moiety: i just realised i used later tell earlier probably wrongly because i was looking at the wrong part of the people list
mikaeldice: I'd like to see bitcoin companies start using a more transparent accounting system that's more detailed than the blockchain. It wouldn't really cut down on fraud, but it might make the incompetent more noticeable and accountable.
fluffypony: mikaeldice: they could just publish their monthlies and prove they have access to the funds they claim by sending it to a public address
mikaeldice: Thanks, mircea_popescu, I've read that post before and enjoyed it.
mircea_popescu: so then what are you talking about ?
benkay: fluffypony: wouldn't simply signing with the addr key suffice?
mircea_popescu: that's the accounting standard, bitcoin companies do use it, etc.
mikaeldice: I was thinking more of an open ledger which automatically updates with expenditures from preset addresses. The user adds a justification, maybe associates an expense account to it
benkay: sounds like a DAC
benkay: burn it with fire
fluffypony: benkay: they may move things around during the month for operational purposes (change addresses in a wallet etc.), so moving it into one address is a very quick operation
benkay: fluffypony: what fraction of corporate funds are you expecting to be in hot storage?
fluffypony: benkay: depends on the type of business
mircea_popescu: why do people constantly want to do things differently than the way things are done i have no idea.
benkay: girl is using the mini sledge to pulverize peanut brittle
thestringpuller: why do people constantly want to do things differently than the way things are done i have no idea. << like when people try to put the square block into the circle hole?
mircea_popescu: what';s a mini sledge ? like a mega peanut ?
mikaeldice: Well, the problem is that things aren't getting done the right way. The system you outline in your website is a good one, but few people use it.
mircea_popescu: mikaeldice all bitcoin corps use it, actually.
benkay: !up mjr_
assbot: Voicing mjr_ for 30 minutes.
fluffypony: mikaeldice: the reason it isn't being done isn't because it's complicated
mikaeldice: Are you narrowly defining what a bitcoin corp is? Taking a look at the securities forum, it's almost not in use by most of the scams and incompetents there. When there is reporting, it's late and/or incomplete..
fluffypony: it's not like if you create an easier system all the scams will be like "ohai, let's be legit!"
mikaeldice: True, but the goal would be to generate red flags on incompetence more than anything
fluffypony: mikaeldice: that would need to be done BEFORE investing
fluffypony: mikaeldice: also, re: what is a "Bitcoin business" - http://blog.spagni.net/posts/2014-04-28/
mircea_popescu: mikaeldice but the scams and incompetents aren't bitcoin corps. i mean it's like saying turbojet propulsion isn't used by model airplanes. sure.
mircea_popescu: they're... not jets.
mircea_popescu: and so your goal is quite visible, isn't it.
mircea_popescu: s/goal/flag
mircea_popescu: benkay not bad!
benkay: lol now she's complaining about the fact that i stole her beer
benkay: told her 'when dinner's actually done then you can have a beer'
mircea_popescu: you got a 70lb chick in the house that cooks with the use of a hammer and wants beer ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16627 @ 0.00097228 = 16.1661 BTC [+] {2}
benkay waits for the punchline
benkay: besides, who ever knows what they want.
BingoBoingo: !up mikaeldice
assbot: Voicing mikaeldice for 30 minutes.
BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market all
gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 443.43, vol: 19086.14496026 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 428.0, vol: 7481.73286 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 442.02, vol: 16133.4219149 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 449.0, vol: 14.56566507 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 430.757808, vol: 3683.01370000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 446.18059, vol: 6.12265595 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 444.6492, vol: 112.2489882 | Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message)
BingoBoingo: ;;more
gribble: 439.460971498
ozbot: The FBI arrests New York Congressman Michael Grimm for fraud, perjury.
ozbot: The Moment A Mississippi TV Station Evacuated For A Tornado
BingoBoingo: I throw that out, because the storm sirens are engaged.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4173 @ 0.00097487 = 4.0681 BTC [+]
thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: srs question for you
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 99 @ 0.00461057 = 0.4564 BTC [+] {2}
thestringpuller: oatmeal raisin or chocolate chip
mircea_popescu: WITH raisins.
benkay: ;;gettrust assbot ericmuyser
gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user ericmuyser: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=ericmuyser | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=ericmuyser | Rated since: Mon Jul 1 01:35:49 2013
benkay: !up ericmuyser
assbot: Voicing ericmuyser for 30 minutes.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 3 @ 0.14 = 0.42 BTC
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10140 @ 0.00096981 = 9.8339 BTC [-]
jurov: !up mikaeldice
assbot: Voicing mikaeldice for 30 minutes.
moiety: white chocolate chip and cashew nut cookies ftw
fluffypony: here is a present for hipsters
moiety: lub lub lub
fluffypony: and with that I go sleep
asciilifeform: 'congressman can also have problems.'
pankkake: nice
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17860 @ 0.00096934 = 17.3124 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: grimm is a textbook case of 'can also have problems.'
asciilifeform: we are, of course, unlikely to learn what it was he refused to play ball with. because people having problems can also have problems.
thestringpuller: that's pretty deep
BingoBoingo: problems beget further problems
thestringpuller: "because people having problems can also have problems"
kakobrekla: >>The Mcdonalds of webcam based adult entertainment is my goal.. And I will keep working at it until I achieve it!
benkay: kakobrekla: whassat?
kakobrekla: forum
mikaeldice: I wonder why he needs a whole franchise when a single site would be sufficient..
mikaeldice: I could see a bitcoin casino with guest webcam models doing well
kakobrekla: im not sure he knows mcd is a franchise
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.0400041 = 0.2 BTC [-]
benkay: !up dR3___
assbot: Voicing dR3___ for 30 minutes.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 10 @ 0.0742218 = 0.7422 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 10 @ 0.034 = 0.34 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 5 @ 0.0400041 = 0.2 BTC [-]
benkay: i dunno why anyone would be going for mcdonald's when there are mircea_popescu's out there
benkay: "buttcoin", etc.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 21 @ 0.04000038 = 0.84 BTC [-] {6}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 16 @ 0.0742218 = 1.1875 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 16 @ 0.0339957 = 0.5439 BTC [-] {2}
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 50 @ 0.00445662 = 0.2228 BTC [-]
jurov: moiety: wanba be The Real Manulcoin ambassador?
pankkake: you mine it with Proof of Cuteness?
jurov: yes, every block must contain cute kitty
midnightmagic: mircea_popescu: a.k.a. crypto-virology, a fairly well-studied problem that primarily (imo) affects closed-source crypto products.
jurov: yea, crypto-virology affects products, crypto-virus people
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36800 @ 0.00097488 = 35.8756 BTC [+] {3}
moiety: jurov: im all for anything manul!
moiety: paper wallets would come pre-shredded tho
pankkake: I only know about crypto-fascism
gribble: Error: "bash" is not a valid command.
gribble: What do you think I am, a shell?
gribble: Error: "dir" is not a valid command.
moiety: pankkake: if you can find an elusive manul block, it'd probably kill your hardware
gribble: Error: "cd" is not a valid command.
moiety: ;; dvd
gribble: Error: "dvd" is not a valid command.
moiety: aw
BingoBoingo: ;;rm / -r -f
gribble: Error: "rm" is not a valid command.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 106 @ 0.001 = 0.106 BTC {2}
mircea_popescu: benkay wait wut
mircea_popescu: mikaeldice: I could see a bitcoin casino with guest webcam models doing well << not a half bad idea.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8350 @ 0.00097178 = 8.1144 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [ALC] 3 @ 0.14 = 0.42 BTC
benkay: mircea_popescu: why chase pennies from paupers when there are guys out there willing to spend single-digit integer fractions of btc for tits?
benkay: !up sunshynez
assbot: Voicing sunshynez for 30 minutes.
benkay: !up skllzdatklls
assbot: Voicing skllzdatklls for 30 minutes.
benkay: hello y'all
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform well, the ny mayor is now communist, that guy is teaparty.
mircea_popescu: !up skllzdatklls
assbot: Voice for skllzdatklls extended to 30 minutes.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 320 @ 0.00446071 = 1.4274 BTC [+] {9}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 80 @ 0.00439967 = 0.352 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22500 @ 0.00097226 = 21.8759 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 25 @ 0.0075 = 0.1875 BTC [+]
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
ozbot: Accounting for the Amazing Company. The Bitcointalk standard. | pankkake
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29700 @ 0.00097581 = 28.9816 BTC [+] {2}
pankkake: this was inspired by irc of course
mircea_popescu: i like the part where you actually use the rfc ~may~ etc conventions
mircea_popescu: plan may consists of acc
pankkake: eheh
mircea_popescu: spurious s
pankkake: I'm bad with s. even in French
mircea_popescu: which was rightfully kept secret s/rightfully/judiciously/ ?
pankkake: yes, better. the second consists should have a s though?
mircea_popescu: if subject is singular verb takes s. if plural, not.
mircea_popescu: niggers come, nigger comes.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 40 @ 0.00457531 = 0.183 BTC [+]
kakobrekla: mircea_popescu what is this even
pankkake: while I should know that simple rule, it just doesn't stick
mircea_popescu: kakobrekla this.
mircea_popescu: help me help you :D
kakobrekla: okay.
peterl: mircea_popescu: mpex.co still lists S.MPIF as upcoming, shouldn't that be removed now that there is a link to F.MPIF in the "funds" section?
mike_c: there is going to be a stock that tracks the fund that tracks the bitcoin economy as a whole.
mike_c: this will in no way create a black hole that takes all ur coinz.
mike_c: or maybe it will.
moiety: lmfao at W.3 pankkake :]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 45 @ 0.04000012 = 1.8 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 10 @ 0.04000002 = 0.4 BTC [-] {2}
decimation: asciilifeform: I think the RSA keyfob hack demonstrates your point about yubikey perfectly
asciilifeform: decimation: wanna try a real mindfuck?
mike_c: ah, the forum is just not worth reading without mpoe-pr. "On average your investment of one BTC on that platform will have yielded about 0 BTC (dividends included) by Autumn."
asciilifeform: decimation: rsa fob is still mandatory in usg, megacorps...
decimation: how is that possibly in their interests?
asciilifeform: decimation: bob can fuck ten thousand goats, and he's still bob the bridge-builder.
decimation: right, but bridges still need to be built
asciilifeform: if you can understand how this works, you understand usa.
decimation: I guess if bob can convince people that his goat orgy is a secure bridge, then he's good to go
asciilifeform: bridges still need to be built << nah, we can cross the water on dead goats.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5000 @ 0.00097132 = 4.8566 BTC [-]
decimation: apparently most folks can't tell the difference between a bridge and a pile of raped goats anyway
decimation: still; why would someone like yubikey watch bob and say "I want me some of that?"
asciilifeform: if you want a quasi-rational understanding of this crap, realize that rsa corp. actually sells
asciilifeform: (theatre)
decimation: the mind reels
asciilifeform: man never really moved 'beyond' what archaeologists call 'sympathetic magic' (as in 'voodoo doll')
mircea_popescu: peterl yeah.
asciilifeform: eat the heart of a lion for courage, of hyena for endurance, etc.
asciilifeform: eat an rsa fob for seekoority.
peterl: anybody want to speculate: will MPIF be actively traded like MPOE, or will it be a snoozer like the other stocks on mpex?
decimation: even the supposed security priests tell the people this
asciilifeform: bon apetit.
mircea_popescu: dead goats swell up if submerged.
asciilifeform: pontoon!
decimation: DId you ever read Asimov's Foundation? The part about the tech-men?
mircea_popescu: peterl kinda curious myself.
ozbot: Liberalism Schafft Sich Ab | Handle's Haus
asciilifeform: recently had occasion to meet herr handle, who wore his medals
asciilifeform: there was one with an md5 hash
decimation: heh I wish I could have met him in person. perhaps one day I shall
asciilifeform: (he lives not far away)
mircea_popescu: handle is a pretty good handle.
decimation: The Law Of Merited Impossibility is an epistemological construct governing the paradoxical way overclass opinion makers frame the discourse about the clash between religious liberty and gay civil rights. It is best summed up by the phrase, ?It?s a complete absurdity to believe that Christians will suffer a single thing from the expansion of gay rights, and boy, do they deserve what they?re going to get.?
asciilifeform: his tale, people were always saying to him 'get a fscking handle'
asciilifeform: so he... did.
decimation: It's not going to happen, and when it does, you people will deserve it.
mircea_popescu: how is "christians" a thing even. the us is mostly neoprotestants,
mircea_popescu: and the silliest sects too.
decimation: Yes, read about the postmillenals some time
decimation: and the dispensationalists
mircea_popescu: these are christians in the sense penguins are awks.
peterl: self-identified christians ... reminds me of self-identified "investors"
decimation: One could argue that they are mostly in the "big tent (john 3:16)" but any of the ancient fathers would have turned them over to be flogged
artifexd: Anyone in here actually use coinbr and would recommend it?
peterl: I use coinbr
asciilifeform: flogged! hah, flayed.
peterl: seems to work nicely
artifexd: ;;gettrust peterl
gribble: Currently authenticated from hostmask peterl!~peterl@108-204-237-26.lightspeed.sgnwmi.sbcglobal.net. Trust relationship from user artifexd to user peterl: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=artifexd&dest=peterl | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=peterl | Rated since: Wed Apr 16 17:10:12 2014
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 17 @ 0.00999996 = 0.17 BTC [+]
BingoBoingo: artifexd: It's a nice thing for using MPEx as a consumer
decimation: ascii did you evern meet that "nydwracu" guy in your DC travels? I think he went to college park
asciilifeform: decimation: sure.
asciilifeform: decimation: met him at a party once.
decimation: he is among the most impressive bloggers I have read
asciilifeform: decimation: i sorta got bored with the moldbugista folks
artifexd: The monthly fee bothered me until I realized that it would take over 130 years for that fee to equal the MPEx entry fee.
decimation: yeah, but he's among the few of them that has original thoughts
asciilifeform: decimation: they remind me of the soviet-era 'kitchen dissidents.' yeah, let's sit around and chat about how much brezhnev sucks.
asciilifeform: what a thrill.
mircea_popescu: decimation the way it works, as far as the orthodox tradition is concerned, catholicism is a bunch of ridiculous simplifications and barbaric nonsense.
decimation: I think you are doing more about the situation than most
mircea_popescu: you can imagine how calvinism looks
peterl: artifexed: and the mpex entry fee trends upward, while the coinbr fee trends downward
mircea_popescu: !up toddf
assbot: Voicing toddf for 30 minutes.
asciilifeform: decimation: i'm a believer in 'propaganda by the deed'
asciilifeform: 'if not you then who, if not now, then when...' etc
decimation: as you have found, moldbug himself is extremely reluctant to take any action that might have second or third-order effects that displease USG
artifexd: peterl How does that work? The MPEx fee is/was/will be 30btc, right? Has the coinbr fee changed over time?
mircea_popescu: peterl given that theres so much info available about how the various pcs are doing, i imagine there should be some lively trading going on
asciilifeform: decimation: mr. m sold his arse to the vc circus
asciilifeform: so his opinions can no longer be regarded as his own
peterl: mpex fee startd at free, then it was 20, now 30. coinbr used to cost more per month
asciilifeform: sorta like losing sole control of one's priv key
decimation: yeah. haven't heard much about his little navy recently
artifexd: mircea_popescu: Do you expect to increase the fee again?
asciilifeform: it's still there, pumping valiantly to stay above waterline.
mircea_popescu: artifexd yes.
asciilifeform: i sold me moldboat for scrap iron, but still check on them occasionally.
peterl: mircea_popescu: having somebody actively market making for the fund should also encourage lively trading, I think
mircea_popescu: maybe yea
decimation: yeah I saw that. I think you profited on the deal
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12700 @ 0.00097617 = 12.3974 BTC [+] {2}
decimation: for a few days I entertained the idea of learning his crazy rune language
decimation: I realized that learning emacs/lisp/forth would be much more profitable
asciilifeform: i swallowed all of that crud whole, as it came out of the arse! who's gonna pay that back.
asciilifeform: but hey, cost of doing business.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you know the story of the woman and the soap ?
mircea_popescu: at this ranch in new mexico, a very old mexican man with a very young and incredibly slutty wife lived.
decimation: yeah one of the unfortunate features of modern electrical engineering is that you find you often invest your soul only to get chickenfeed in return
mircea_popescu: everyone fucked her, all the cowboys, all the farm hands...
mircea_popescu: one day the rancher takes the old guy aside and points out to him that the woman is a paragon of indiscretion, with all the discretion and awkward shyness you'd expect out of a true blue american.
mircea_popescu: the old man is a little amused. "so what of it ? you think cunt is made of soap, to run out with use ?"
mircea_popescu: heads are cunts, swallowing shit whole doesn't hurt them any,
mircea_popescu: provided the stuff finds its way out too.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: there's a soviet variant, where the 'horned man', an old army officer, answers 'better to eat honey in company than - shit, by one's lonesome'
decimation: except, there are only so many minutes in one's life
mircea_popescu: decimation so you saving yours for later ?
decimation: that's a fair point
mircea_popescu: hehe i'm grateful for not having to explain it.
decimation: I guess it's better to have learned and lost than never to have known at all
asciilifeform: at any rate, the hilariously funny bit about urbit is that mr. m wrote volumes condemning american academia, pseudo-mathematics in algorithmics, etc. - and then proceeded to crap out a widget emblematic of same.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you know, all women currently hated by their daughters for being insufferable
mircea_popescu: were daughters hating their mothers for being insufferable
mircea_popescu: and, of course, swearing to do so much better.
mircea_popescu: which was, obviously, quite an easy task, too.
asciilifeform: 'immutable data,' 'strong typing,' etc. - all crud invented by mathemasturbators in their efforts to pretend that they are proving theorems
mircea_popescu: it's only the insufferably devilish nature of the mothers that ruined it, otherwise being cool is straightforward.
mircea_popescu: "When people’s lives and careers are subject to litmus tests, and fired if they do not publicly renounce what may well be their sincere conviction, we have crossed a line. This is McCarthyism applied by civil actors. "
mircea_popescu: i recall this exact derpage published by... whatever, some libertard legal blog.
mircea_popescu: "o, speech has consequences".
asciilifeform: mr m & co got a few $mil from vc. i admit that i check back on these folks only in hope of being the first to see when they get sued by a 'diversity' werker for strong typing systems being sexist or whatnot.
mircea_popescu: by the way, did you hear about the renaming of semesters at mit ?
mircea_popescu: turns out semesters are sexist
mircea_popescu: shall be ovesters henceforth.
asciilifeform: these folks have sailed over the 'parody horizon' long ago - anything's possible.
asciilifeform: laugh now - cry later
asciilifeform: '1' is a phallic symbol! henceforth, only '0' is permitted.
mircea_popescu: balanced ternary. because lezzies are 10x more likely to live threesomes than heterosexual scum
pankkake: unless you have a font with a slashed zero…
mircea_popescu: (.) and (|) will be the new digits.
BingoBoingo: !up Mats_cd03
assbot: Voicing Mats_cd03 for 30 minutes.
decimation: speaking of "diversity" worker: http://today.duke.edu/2014/03/tybt
decimation: "But as the campaign has gained national popularity, its detractors have bristled at the effort, calling it a politically correct war on words that will stifle free speech and suggesting its true aim is to redefine terms to control public opinion and ? ultimately ? public policy."
thestringpuller: ;;seen mod6
gribble: mod6 was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 5 hours, 9 minutes, and 27 seconds ago: <mod6> %diff
atcbot: [ATC Diff] Current Diff: 455357.13 Est. Next Diff: 170342.17 in 1921 blocks (#32256) Est. % Change: -62.59
mod6: what's up thestringpuller
mircea_popescu: "It’s not going to happen, and when it does, you people will deserve it."
mircea_popescu: he means, of course, "It’s not going to happen, and when it does, you people will have deserved it."
mircea_popescu: why is grammar a lost art!
decimation: because students were insufficiently punished in school for using poor grammar
decimation: I actually quoted the above from this link: http://www.thecollegefix.com/post/17212/
mircea_popescu feels so nice and cozy in his nicely built brick housy. just like a piggy
decimation: I think future historians will call this era "the golden age of mendacity"
BingoBoingo is simply happy the tornados spared this house today
decimation: in the US it is customary to make a house out of the cheapest materials available, on the smallest possible lot (to maximize the builder's profit)
mircea_popescu: ah, to be rich, and powerful, and say nigger faggot whenever one feels like.
mircea_popescu: you know... i may be the only one.
ozbot: Donald Sterling racism: Why the Los Angeles Clippers need to boycott their next playoff game.
ozbot: Liberalism Schafft Sich Ab | Handle's Haus
mircea_popescu: it's beyond contemptible.
mircea_popescu: "I think that this agreement, were it feasible, would benefit all concerned."
mircea_popescu: guy's simply managed to persuade me that he should indeed be lynched.
decimation: yeah I couldn't figure out wtf he was on about
mircea_popescu: <decimation> as you have found, moldbug himself is extremely reluctant to take any action that might have second or third-order effects that displease USG <<< that sorta thing.
decimation: "land of the free" indeed
mircea_popescu: in general by examining the reality in the field, rather than whatever naive theories of the eager teenagers, one dicovers the opressed generally deserve it.
decimation: most of the elite are busy binding the next generation while they fail to reproduce
decimation: at the heart of the progressive religion is a great desire to cut loose the straps that bind the devil
decimation: all in the name of freedom, liberation, and enlightenment
mircea_popescu: i kinda appreciate the sentiment tbh. let the devil be free.
decimation: well, there is certainly wisdom in giving people exactly what they want
decimation: as punishment
mircea_popescu: generally, devils are a lot more fun than the pompous idiots cutting them free.
BingoBoingo: Who really wants to go to heaven if you have to live like a Saint while there?
mircea_popescu: exactly.
mircea_popescu: course, this may be a bitch for anyone trying to raise children or you know, live the life of X.
mircea_popescu: but hey. life's supposed to be interesting not satisfactory.
decimation: your orthodox fathers would certainly endorse that sentiment
mircea_popescu: moreover, all this obsessive, controlling shit...
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 40 @ 0.0045299 = 0.1812 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: humans are supposed to watch half their litter impaled before their very eyes, not to pester them to death with vaporub.
mircea_popescu: in short, things are going well, for any natural definition of "well".
asciilifeform: in the words of a recent u.s. presidential candidate, 'don't impeach - impale.'
decimation: there is no doubt that the west suffers because of its freedom from want
BingoBoingo: decimation: Not freedom from want, freedom from intelligible want.
decimation: well, I mean "want" as in "want of the actual necessities of life"
mircea_popescu: yeah i was thinking, they want aplenty, it's just they never actually confront it.
mircea_popescu: this pretense of wantlessness is lulzy.
mircea_popescu: decimation yes. actual necessities. such as food, as opposed to fast food.
mircea_popescu: !up go1111111
assbot: Voicing go1111111 for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: such as living space as opposed to... whatever.
ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log
asciilifeform: 'eat recycled food. it's good for the environment, and ok for you!'
mircea_popescu: i actually talked it over with a couple of people over lunch. it's our considered opinion that the difference between the us and the ro health care systems can be distilled in one very simple point :
mircea_popescu: romania does not admit tort proceedings for unrealised damages.
mircea_popescu: that's it.
ozbot: Eat recycled food for a happier healthier life --- (Judge Dredd movie) -watch stoned - YouTube
mircea_popescu: unless you can bring a bill of sale showing your eye is worth $100, you can't get $100 for your eye. and that's that.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 14 @ 0.00999996 = 0.14 BTC [+]
decimation: yeah the "insurance" doctors in the us must carry against unrealized damage claims is an incredible tax
mircea_popescu: amusingly, it has exactly zero to do with doctors, hospitals or budgets.
mircea_popescu: which is why the entire mess is so difficult to fix : like one of those old products of mad artisanry, nothing works as intended, everything's tied up in unrelated parts.
mircea_popescu: if the us were a program, it'd be discarded as unmaintainable.
decimation: http://rwcg.wordpress.com/2014/04/23/corrective-glossary/ health care: any arrangement with a corporation in which you send money to them monthly and they sent you a brochure at the beginning, but may or may not pay you anything in return; e.g. ?With Obamacare at least I have health care?
ozbot: Corrective glossary | Rhymes With Cars & Girls
asciilifeform: paging herr orlov,
ozbot: ClubOrlov: Hunger Insurance
mircea_popescu: such a stupid name, too. where were all the branding experts ?
mircea_popescu: it'll turn into "obama doesn't care" in short order.
mircea_popescu: why expose yourself so. i'd have never ok'd that stupid shit.
mircea_popescu: i'll make mpex and mpif, not mpcare.
decimation: "healthcare (alt.): birth-control pills and/or rubbers"
BingoBoingo: The complexity of healthcare billing in the US adds a whole new layer of hell.
mircea_popescu: "To be perfectly honest, those jobs are reserved for my children, but yours might still be able to find work as their personal bathroom assistants, if they are docile and pretty... let's pretend you didn't hear that."
mircea_popescu: is this supposed to be some sort of dirty secret or something ?
mircea_popescu: obviously. docile and pretty or starve. what of it.
decimation: there is little doubt that the Augean Stables of the west are piled with mountains of horse shit. who is going to wash them clean?
mircea_popescu: decimation james guy, quoted earlier.
mircea_popescu: anyway, enough philosophy for one night. later all!
decimation: he had a blog for awhile but it appears it was taken over by scammers: https://web.archive.org/web/20120717073425/http://james-g.com/
decimation: asciilifeform: had to switch to 4-layer. << did you do your own layout or did you hire that out?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 2000 @ 0.001 = 2 BTC
benkay: "unrealized damages" that is to say 'my eyesight was worth 100B, but now i have no eyes, therefore pay me 100B'?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SF2] 680 @ 0.001 = 0.68 BTC
decimation: benkay: don't forget that the lawyers get a big cut of the 100B
benkay: decimation: driving more tort suits?
decimation: loltron: http://www.nsa.gov/public_info/_files/cryptologic_quarterly/NSA_Culture.pdf : "NSA will undoubtly have to keep staying agile, valuing qualifications (even if on paper), speed, productivity and decisiveness, while acknowledging the need for accuracy, expertise and informed decisions."
decimation: sounds like bureau-speak for "we hire idiots and they produce nothing"
asciilifeform: decimation: 100% hand
asciilifeform: did you hire that out << must be joking
decimation: hehe I figured not
decimation: what software did you use for the design? your choice is either crap open source or crap $$$
asciilifeform: combination of both
decimation: years ago I did some hand routing with orcad. It made me feel like a money trapped in a traveling salesman's trunk
decimation: s/money/monkey/
asciilifeform: i've yet to meet an autorouter 'worth the electrons it's printed on'
asciilifeform: but perhaps this is because i don't do winblows
decimation: weirdly all of the "good" EE design packages are winblows only
decimation: there is a weird divorce in culture between EE's who build hardware and EE's who touch software
asciilifeform: it was never entirely clear to me what makes these 'good'
asciilifeform: well ok, they'll calculate meanders for HF circuits.
asciilifeform: whooptydoo
decimation: ascii have you ever used 'qucs'? I played with it a little bit and found it to be pretty neat
asciilifeform: decimation: sure
asciilifeform: the only weirdo analogue piece in my current work is the rng, and, as you might expect, it doesn't simulate.
decimation: yeah I would think not
asciilifeform: (well, technically, sure it does. but to no useful end)
decimation: I assume that you aren't clocking the thing very high either?
asciilifeform: what'd be the point
decimation: there would be no point, other than to make yourself work harder
decimation: http://www.greenarraychips.com/home/documents/greg/WP002-100405-energycons.pdf Greenarrays has an app note: how to emulate a C machine on top of your asynchronous stack machines
asciilifeform: folks expecting to play 'doom' on cardano will be disappointed.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 30 @ 0.00456341 = 0.1369 BTC [+]
decimation: apparently it is popular to prototype the greenarrays chips on a "schmart board": http://www.schmartboard.com/
decimation: basically you tack the qfn down and then use a really fine tipped soldering iron to "push" the solder in little grooves up under the chip
asciilifeform: one day i'll actually get a hold of a greenarrays
decimation: supposedly it works, but it sounds a little hokey to me
asciilifeform: decimation: generally i do paste+reflow
decimation: yeah that sounds much simpler
decimation: that usually implies some cleanup too, but if you have a well-made board with good mask and clean contacts you are usually okay (surface tension of liquid metal is miraculous)
asciilifeform: mask, gold contacts.
asciilifeform: one can apply paste with stencil, or with pump, or even... toothpick. but this subject is beaten to death elsewhere.
asciilifeform: (chinese paste pump, about 100 usd)
decimation: I used a syringe, but it got really messy
asciilifeform: paste pump consists of the very same syringe, but farts out puffs of air of controlled volume
asciilifeform: (in place of plunger)
decimation: so you get a little blob instead?
asciilifeform: correct
asciilifeform: little box, control dial, pedal, two hoses (one to compressor, one to syringe)
decimation: sounds legit. so you have a hot air rework station too I presume?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15551 @ 0.00097132 = 15.105 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: a hot air tube is
asciilifeform: 'nt terribly good for reflow, though
asciilifeform: i use an ordinary electric hob.
asciilifeform: (plus ir thermometer)
asciilifeform: steel anvil as heat spreader
decimation: what about the traditional modifed toaster oven?
asciilifeform: but, there is no shortage of material re: how to do this.
asciilifeform: decimation: no oven. space constraints. perhaps in new flat.
asciilifeform: generally, when making a few prototypes of something, simple tools suffice.
decimation: yeah I think the electric hob would give more control anyway
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13700 @ 0.00096946 = 13.2816 BTC [-] {2}
benkay: !up the20year1
assbot: Voicing the20year1 for 30 minutes.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG] 17 @ 0.00999996 = 0.17 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 2 @ 0.0775 = 0.155 BTC [+] {2}
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