Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2014-01-13 | 2014-01-15 → ↓
asciilifeform: 'A contract is essentially an automated agent that lives on the Ethereum network, has an Ethereum address and balance, and can send and receive transactions.'
asciilifeform: did i miss something? where does it live? on a particular machine? or on every node running the block chain?
asciilifeform: (if it's the former, this is deadly boring)
kakobrekla: prolly as "the client"
asciilifeform: the widespread obsession with 'memory-hard' workfunctions is peculiar
asciilifeform: as if DRAM had never been invented
asciilifeform: or it were somehow impossible to obtain cheaply
Duffer1: just a tactic to attract miners left out of the sha race
fract4l: As a result, we have a protocol with unique potential; rather than being a closed-ended, single-purpose protocol intended for a specific array of applications in data storage, gambling or finance, Ethereum is open-ended by design, and we believe that it is extremely well-suited to serving as a foundational layer for a very large number of both financial and non-financial protocols in the years to come.
fract4l: pwned.
fract4l: Ethereum >> *
ozbot: xkcd: Standards
asciilifeform: how did this fellow miss the obvious usefulness of programmable workfunctions?
asciilifeform: he 'went meta' on nearly everything else
asciilifeform: but not this
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Turing coin? That ultimate FPGA coin you've mentioned before.
asciilifeform: one possible name, yes.
kakobrekla: i think it could prove hard to lauch a sha coin nowdays, since a lot of people can fuck with the blockchain
kakobrekla: on these small coins
asciilifeform: the 'memory hard' people are what is known in the armchair general community as a 'target-rich environment.'
Duffer1: they'd bend your blockchain over and do terrible terrible things to it
asciilifeform: the first joker who bothers to bake an scrypt asic will devour the altchains like smallpox devoured aboriginals
nubbins`: ..with infected blankets?
asciilifeform: or hell, even fpga with sdram controller
Duffer1: i hope that happens quickly, it'd be nice to see what devs come up with to counter 'scrypt asics'
asciilifeform: anything short of programmable workfunction will lead to a cat'n'mouse game rather expensive and unproductively unpleasant for all involved.
asciilifeform: at first glance, it would seem like the altchain devs could always outrun the asic folks
asciilifeform: given that it costs nothing to spawn a new alt, with a new workfunction, while asics are costly
asciilifeform: but this is a mistaken idea
asciilifeform: every forced move of this kind is a 'schism event'
Duffer1: they'll still have to attract miners, and attempt to mitigate the effects of launch attacks/stability
asciilifeform: and drives a wedge between user groups with conflicting interests (existing stakeholders want a difficult-to-mine coin, those who invested in miners want the miners to keep working)
Duffer1: how to evolve beyond cpu/mem intense functions?
asciilifeform: hard to attract miners if you make total war on them when they start to succeed.
Duffer1: devs are only worried about their own coin though
Duffer1: so they have to attract miners somehow
Duffer1: it's a fascinating ecosystem
asciilifeform: right now, panicking idiots are overwhelmingly incentivising covert mining.
asciilifeform: that is, if you are a large miner, it is increasingly a bad idea to look like what you are
Duffer1: hehe
asciilifeform: instead, buy ipv4 space, etc. the way spammers do.
asciilifeform: prog. workfunctions would give you a single coin with multiple workfunctions ('coloured' by origin, if you like), and so the actual market value of a particular 'work' could be determined.
Duffer1: one coin with variable pow?
asciilifeform: say, i want mr. moron's md5 hash 'cracked.' i offer to trade 10btc for 1000 moronhashcrackcoins.
asciilifeform: the whole exercise takes place on the block chain.
asciilifeform: you, the worker, know that it is an honest trade, because you bring 100 moronhashcoins and get 1 btc, every step of the way, for arbitrarily small chunks.
asciilifeform: (actually coughing up a workfunction that does useful work is left as an exercise for the alert reader.)
BingoBoingo: X-Ray crystalography as a useful work function?
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: you're probably thinking of ab initio protein folding
asciilifeform: x-ray crystallography is an actual physical measurement
asciilifeform: but it's one way to solve the energy-minimal 'where should the atoms go' question, yes.
asciilifeform: an altchain that *actually folds* would have no problem with wealth injection from the 'meatspace' universe
Duffer1: indeed
asciilifeform: (vs. an idiotchain that merely promises with kind words to fund things)
Duffer1: curecoin
Duffer1: >.<
asciilifeform: that'd be an example of the 'promises'
Duffer1: yea
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 9 @ 0.02696494 = 0.2427 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: the problem with workfunctions that do something useful is that, unless the supply of such jobs naturally tapers off (all interesting proteins found in nature eventually 'folded')
asciilifeform: you get an inflationary coin
BingoBoingo: Well X-Ray crystallography is indeed a hard physical problem with varying and more expensive levels of difficulty. X-raying a mineral crystal isn't so bad. A given protein in fluid is a bit harder. Getting a good picture of a receptor protein as it sits in the cell membrane is an incredibly hard problem.
asciilifeform: 'hard' isn't enough for the purpose of coin, you also need ease of verification.
asciilifeform: the subtle thing here is that 'useful' workfuncts must coexist with 'useless' ones - ideally, in the same blockchain.
asciilifeform: because they serve entirely different purposes
asciilifeform: (one is to promote a certain calculation; the other - store of value.)
asciilifeform: result at the end of the day should be to make it a hard fact that anyone who carries out the kind of calculation you want done, ends up with X btc for his trouble
asciilifeform: (conventional btc)
Duffer1: asciicoin inc?
asciilifeform: Duffer1: in case this wasn't obvious, this is not a product that threatens to actually exist.
Duffer1: lol i am aware :P
asciilifeform: and were it to exist, i'd have no part of it (otherwise occupied.)
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35031 @ 0.0008455 = 29.6187 BTC [-]
KRS1: yes as Duffer1 said fascinating ecosystem
asciilifeform: at the risk of repeating myself: 'moronhashcrackcoin' or 'foldprotein1B41coin' only has value to whoever commissioned that calculation.
asciilifeform: the person who carries it out will expect to be paid in something that is actually a stable store of value
asciilifeform: (coin with 'useless' workfunction, difficulty rampup, all the things we know and love)
Duffer1: perceived utility beyond energy wasting will drive popularity and coin value
Duffer1: xpm is great example
asciilifeform: if this were really so, 'curecoin' and the like would be great hits.
asciilifeform: but even with a coin that provably represents useful work: why should someone give you gold or cocaine because you helped fold a protein?
Duffer1: meh their pow doesn't actually do anything
asciilifeform: unless they in particular wished it folded
Duffer1: the perception is obviously that utility will drive adoption and popularity and value
asciilifeform: from the 'store of value' point of view, they expect that they can get a similar quantity of g or c or whatnot for the coin later.
asciilifeform: as far as i can tell (by no means an expert view), the thing that mainly drives adoption of classic btc is precisely reliability-as-store-of-value.
Duffer1: it's different with alts though, since they're all tied to how many bitcoins can i get for my shitcoin
asciilifeform: alts as the presently exist seem like a modernized version of 'penny stocks'
Duffer1: indeed, but with the potential to rapidly become something else
asciilifeform: scammers scam, and people who think themselves more clever than the scammer try to ride along
Duffer1: the right pow can change everything
asciilifeform: then, of course, is the other end of this spectrum:
asciilifeform: slavecoin.
asciilifeform: 'pow' based on proving that you wasted the time of living people, vs. mere machines.
KRS1: reading this conversation vs gmaxwell's conversation in -pricetalk is hurting my brain a little.
KRS1: you both had me glued
Duffer1: ascii knows far more about this than i do, i'm just going off what i've observed from the primecoin example
asciilifeform: crackpot hypothesis: every new cryptocoin can be seem as an attempt to 'replay' the history of money
asciilifeform: with (optionally) 'different winners'
asciilifeform: which 'winners' are optimized for, determines whether you get a turd (known alts) or something interesting ('classic' btc)
Duffer1: i wouldn't call that crackpot at all
Duffer1: but i see evolution there as well
KRS1: primecoin is very interesting to me
KRS1: imo the only altcoin that might have value besides nmc
KRS1: but then again asciilifeform showed me how it too is worthless
asciilifeform: isn't that where they had nominally 'unspendable' reserves that got spent?
truffles: coinyecoin is best noob
Duffer1: all hail the brilliance of those devs
KRS1: no ipo for coinecoin and has no dogelike meme
asciilifeform: you can cut any 'weirdo' alt into two kinds of parts: actual mechanical parts - what will continue to work in just the algorithmic way specified, by 'byzantine' consensus of the participant nodes; and 'promises' - parts that depend on a handful of human doing as they promised
asciilifeform: the former is concrete and steel, the latter - 'duct tape.'
asciilifeform: btc is heavy on the concrete and steel; 'curecoin' (for example) is mostly tape.
Duffer1: indeed
asciilifeform: concrete/steel have breaking points, specified strength
Duffer1: what would you say of primecoin though?
asciilifeform: tape holds until it doesn't (yes, actual duct tape is a material that can be dealt with scientifically; we're thinking of the traditional 'philosophical' duct tape that just fscking snaps on you)
asciilifeform: i vaguely recall primecoin having its public goatfuck moment
asciilifeform: but, to be honest, i'm not the one to ask
asciilifeform: i don't really keep track of the 'scene', and in fact ended up in this channel entirely by accident!
truffles: some1 spammed this chanel in btc otc :(
Duffer1: otc gives me seizures
truffles: i wonder if im still banned :D
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 94 @ 0.00534796 = 0.5027 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.54 = 2.7 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 250 @ 0.001 = 0.25 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 6 @ 0.02696494 = 0.1618 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 5 @ 0.02696494 = 0.1348 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.55439999 = 1.1088 BTC [+] {2}
ozbot: Cloudhashing ASIC mining contracts, UK LTD company - Now Mining & Paying Bitcoin
mircea_popescu: epic shit
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 40 @ 0.0499997 = 2 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: ;;ticker
gribble: MtGox BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 938.82312, Best ask: 939.995, Bid-ask spread: 1.17188, Last trade: 939.89999, 24 hour volume: 8078.57644668, 24 hour low: 880.11, 24 hour high: 943.0, 24 hour vwap: 910.90486
mircea_popescu: ahh look at that. will we be blessed so that 2014 is the year of bitcoin stability ?
ozbot: 1789546951.05324 | Next Diff in 1813 blocks | Estimated Change: 16.8054% in 10d 11h 6m 5s
davout: bitcoin has always been stable
davout: 1 BTC = 1 BTC since Jan. 3 2009
mircea_popescu: ok ok, my bad. will the us be blessed with the year of usd stability ?
twizt: anyone know if these are any good
ozbot: IBM Redbooks | IBM System x3650 M4
mircea_popescu: never used one myself.
twizt: what do you think tho?
twizt: my ex-job has 5 more of these
twizt: i feel like taking em lol
mircea_popescu: well... free stuff, why not
twizt: nah actuall not free
twizt: $750 for all 5
mircea_popescu: prolly about what they're worth
twizt: worth about 2k each
mircea_popescu: these are used neh ?
twizt: yea have all harddrive slots
twizt: the solid state drives them selves are gold
mircea_popescu: so then what's the problem ?
twizt: im being lazy
twizt: gotta hire some mexicans to go pick em up
Vexual: you'll be able to run 5 bitcoin nodes in december
twizt: haha y december
Vexual: 100mb blocks and shit
twizt: ah gotcha
truffles: vexual whats for dinner today?
Vexual: fish!
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21865 @ 0.00084723 = 18.5247 BTC [+] {2}
truffles: dont have any of that
truffles: guess ill try for toco's night
Vexual: todays fish is trout al la creme
truffles: self made or ?
Vexual: yes i am not rich enought to reasturant constantly
truffles: bitcoin milliionaires everywhere
Vexual: indeed
truffles: but not all asses, its strange
Vexual: assets?
truffles: massive egos
Vexual: oh yes
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 24 @ 0.02696494 = 0.6472 BTC [+] {4}
truffles: i wonder if ppl those ppl with complaints of me doing "something useful" r upset about all the lines theyre forced to read :D
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 39 @ 0.00375076 = 0.1463 BTC [+] {3}
truffles: cuz obv every1 seems to read logs around here
Vexual: do yo udo anything useful?
truffles: i dunno, i exist though
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 127 @ 0.00381244 = 0.4842 BTC [+] {2}
truffles: do u?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 34 @ 0.00387999 = 0.1319 BTC [+] {2}
mircea_popescu: bare existence is not useful.
mircea_popescu: and yes, that's why you end up on ignore lists, cause you yak unimportantly.
truffles: u only read important things eh
truffles: if i shift through that blog will that be the case?
mircea_popescu: i read lots of shit really. but that's what makes me so unique.
truffles: orly
mircea_popescu: most people equally powerful you can't ever talk to.
truffles: being an ass isnt unique though
mircea_popescu: here's the problem with the world : it's what it is, not what;d be convenient for your own head it be.
truffles: define powerful
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3685 @ 0.00085133 = 3.1372 BTC [+]
Vexual: the ability to effect change
mircea_popescu: you know, he who can do things.
truffles: like a mod?
Vexual: no like yourself first
truffles: there are ppl who view themselves as more significant than others i get that
mircea_popescu: no, like thoth, the original billionaire and congressman rolled into one
truffles: billionaires can die too
mircea_popescu: gods can die too. that's not really all that relevant now is it.
truffles: well im of the monotheist
mircea_popescu: even marginal jewish sects imported the dead god trope.
truffles: im also agnostic so..
mircea_popescu: you're generally a lazy fuckwit that imagines he can redefine things in his head and that'll matter. it doesn't, obviously, but what difference does it make.
truffles: oh so u know me personally now
mircea_popescu: it's not hard to do.
truffles: orly
mircea_popescu: incidentally, that's one symptom of the unimportant : they may think they're personal, but in point of fact they're impersonal and universally so. even things they do in private are really quite impersonal.
mircea_popescu: i guess the term for it is commonplace or banal.
mircea_popescu: anyway : it's not that i know you personally. it's that knowing you implies no personal anything.
truffles: hmmm
mircea_popescu: admire how this chatlog suddenly became readable, even interesting.
mircea_popescu: now you have an example of what powerful means.
truffles: i dont know where to begin with that heh
truffles: the delusion is so high i dunno
twizt: lol
Vexual: woth thoth won five days of light from the moon, what at player
Vexual: for want of a btter desciptor
truffles: well that was a surprise, i figured every1 was atheist
truffles: vexual hope u dont have such a high opinion of urself
Vexual: theres no big m for starters
truffles: very influential
Vexual: no havelock
twizt: lol
Vexual: no kraken
twizt: damn icbit made it there
jurov: kraken is there, under forex :D
Vexual: oh there is kraken
twizt: lol weexchange made it there
twizt: wtf
mircea_popescu: jesus that thing's giving me a migraine it's so busy
mircea_popescu: anyway, mtgox ?
Vexual: itd be interesting to highlight the logos over time of existance
davout: inputs.io made it to wallets
mircea_popescu: lol coinlenders
mircea_popescu: http://www.gcasavvian.com/ << "experience relationships advice" ?
ozbot: GCA Savvian - Home
mircea_popescu: who the f are these muppets ?
mircea_popescu: Dec 29 2013Notice regarding successful partial exit by Mezzanine Corporation(Dec 30, 2013)
mircea_popescu: sounds darling, perhaps they make the move out of dating & relationship advice by ditching the pdf bs.
jurov: jon matonis
mircea_popescu: "Mezzanine Corporation (Head Office: Chuo‐ku, Tokyo; Representative Director: Koji Sasayama),
mircea_popescu: a wholly‐owned subsidiary of GCA Savvian Corporation, has succeeded in the partial exit of 1.3 billion yen of preferred stock by its investment business limited partnership."
mircea_popescu: ok that conversion was worth doing
Vexual: some logos are illegible, i hope they didn't pay too much
mircea_popescu: people using terms of art as if they were hired hookers these days.
mircea_popescu: jurov matonis is actually a native english speaker afaik. is this some sort of "we're going to namedrop" relationship where his involvement is having sometime commented on them or something and now they're running with it ?
jurov: likely, he's among three named as "advisory board"
jurov: no other presons are named there
jurov: (speaking about bitcointrust.co)
Vexual: is he the labcoin guy?
mircea_popescu: Vexual no, he's an old time advocate and the original guy with a press job that did bitcoin some fair reporting
mircea_popescu: meanwhile got kicked out of the bitcoin scamdation (which he foolishly helped create) by the sort of backroom politicking vessenes lives for.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.53964 = 2.6982 BTC [-] {3}
Vexual: fuck trying to read bitcoin history is like trying to download the bloackchain with a 286 and bandicoot powered internet
mircea_popescu: if i recall he was "not notable" enough or something of the sort, being of course the only one in the entire list who actually had some sort of cred.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 3 @ 0.53453333 = 1.6036 BTC [-] {2}
davout: isn't he chair of the foundation or sthg?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.531 BTC [-]
Vexual: i bet i could get into the aussie chapter, it'd take em 6 months to realise I don't acutally do C++
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.55489997 BTC [+]
truffles: cuz ure that good at faking it
Vexual: aussie
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 2000 @ 0.001 = 2 BTC [+]
Vexual: notice how our banks arent imploding
truffles: yet :D
Vexual: lady bullshit is state of the art here
Vexual: get some aussie into washington and theres no problem
Vexual: we can GE a sheep with 10 micron wool for mr armani, or dig up metal, so we're pretty solid
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 50 @ 0.005 = 0.25 BTC
mircea_popescu: lol @this case before the us supreme court. so obama declares the senate in recess cause he feels like, makes a bunch of recess appointments
Vexual: off to barbados?
mircea_popescu: now the supreme court has somehow to extricate itself from this mess.
Vexual: link?
ozbot: Court appears ready to nix recess appointment power - First Read
truffles: is romania insignificant or is its politics on the blog?
Vexual: romania isnt the worlds bank
Vexual: [19:24] <truffles> not yet
Vexual: mircea, are you a lawyer?
truffles: wouldve been shocked
mircea_popescu: truffles there's some romanian politics on trilema, mostly under "politica si prostie"
truffles: just wondering, seems finance ppl r forced to talk about the US
Vexual: what did you study at university? if you don't mind me asking?
mircea_popescu: i have degrees in philosophy and anthropology.
Vexual: did you study commerce too?
truffles: that is shocking
mircea_popescu: arguably being romanian they're actually worth something, unlike their us counterparts
mircea_popescu: but nevertheless, that something isn't much at all.
Vexual: you learned computer science by yourself too?
VanCleef: oh good something original mp talking about how awesome he is
mircea_popescu: VanCleef dude don't be a hater, he asked me. what am i to do ?
truffles: lmao
mircea_popescu: Vexual no, i mostly learned that by managing people who did it for a living.
VanCleef: you know i love you
truffles: managing hmmm
truffles: for a philosophy student ur world views so narrow dam dude
VanCleef: money changed him
mircea_popescu: narrow compared to what ?
Vexual: can you read sanscrit?
mircea_popescu: not without my books.
truffles: money seems to change ppl, but i suspect not him heh
Vexual: he could be in st kitts being an arsehole
mircea_popescu: truffles http://trilema.com/2013/a-very-unfair-perspective/ there, read that, save yourself a lot of effort trying to argue that somehow the very narrow "we're all equal and we fight inequality derp" worldview is somehow less narrow than any.other.possible.worldview.
VanCleef: he use to go around helping homeless people and even gave a kidney to his best friend
truffles: i dont like reading ur blog, it seems u dont put much effort into the grammar
assbot: Last 1 lines bashed and pending review. (http://dpaste.com/1550641/plain/)
Vexual: i don't think he'd give away a kidney, it might be a drain on the economy
mircea_popescu: fucking epic.
VanCleef: now he just rides in his jetski in his bathtub made out of diamonds and his pet dolphin
mircea_popescu: VanCleef i only help homeless people if they're female, kinda young, kinda cute and really, really into it.
Vexual: he wouldn't ride a jetski unless his crew designed it
truffles: ur flow of thought often seems disconnected, i dont usually get it
mircea_popescu: truffles that's not what grammar means.
truffles: + the bad grammar
VanCleef: "you look cock fasmished, let me help you"
truffles: but u know i did ask, so let me attempt
mircea_popescu: that wouldn't be very practical. i can only get it up what, a few times a day ?
mircea_popescu: lot more homeless than that around.
VanCleef: since you bought all their houses ya
truffles: id so own at monopoly though
mircea_popescu: thanks to all the inequality fightin', bout one in ten us folk are homeless, one in three yurepan kids are unemployed or unemployable and so on.
VanCleef: excellent
VanCleef: they deserve it
Vexual: ever been hungry vancleef?
VanCleef: no poor people are ew
VanCleef: i eat zebras for dinner
VanCleef: i'm rich
Vexual: pharoahs fed people
mircea_popescu: well they also banged their sisters
VanCleef: not as rich as MP tho who could buy and sell your family 10 times over
mircea_popescu: ;;google sell me your children
gribble: blues brothers - sell me your children - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvZgwtpPmLY>; Blues Brothers - Sell me your children - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbsMZecRgbI>; How much for the little girl? - YouTube: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GDXYzUlv0S8>
Vexual: yeah and when there was nothing to do they built pyramids
VanCleef: can i ask a serious question
VanCleef: have you ever been in love mp?
mircea_popescu: all teh time.
VanCleef: its a good feeling to have
mircea_popescu: why so possesive :D
VanCleef: are you in love at the moment?
truffles: with himself prob
VanCleef: if i was mp id jerk off to myself in front of the mirror too
truffles: orly
VanCleef: wouldn't u?
mircea_popescu: sure dude. i love my slavegirls jus' fine.
KRS1: Mmmm
mircea_popescu: and also my country, teh most serene republic of bitcoin.
KRS1: .bait
VanCleef: nah that's not love mp
VanCleef: think back when you were 15
mircea_popescu: how would you know what's love and what isn't ?
VanCleef: your first crush
VanCleef: do you remember that feeling?
KRS1: .bait
mircea_popescu: yes, well, when you were three you probably ate your own shit, too.
mircea_popescu: does that mean yo ucan't be a gourmet chef ?
truffles: i managed to get to sentence 2 , so basically u hate empathy?
VanCleef: so you've never felt real love before mp?
ArsKisS: VanCleef, what first crush? no girl can crush me
mircea_popescu: truffles nope. i dislike the sort of lazy fuckwit who imagines magic works. which is what you're trying to do with "Empathy" and this guy is trying to do with "twu wuv", create some sort of magical amulet that'll save you from having to, you know, live.
truffles: a world where every1 just takes
VanCleef: i hope its something you get to experience oneday
VanCleef: its a really good feeling
mircea_popescu: me living your preconceived notion ? i have no doubt it'd be a good feeling, only problem is
truffles: i believe in moderation, i dont recognize that view ure posing
mircea_popescu: it;s supposed to be a good feeling for me, not for you.
VanCleef: just open your heart oneday mp
VanCleef: you might enjoy it
mircea_popescu: you're trippin all over a strawman.
VanCleef: just promise me you'll keep an open mind and when the time is right a open heart?
truffles: an open heart for love?
VanCleef: i dont want the sickness to completely take over that sweet young man i use to know before all this bitcoin stuff
mircea_popescu: im starting to understand why romantic comedies sell so well. they really managed to create their own captive market huh.
truffles: why r u wanting him to find love now
VanCleef: he's not ready
truffles: pm him ur fandom
truffles: u could be the one
VanCleef: its not all about money
VanCleef: sometimes we just want someone to hug
VanCleef: and i feel mp's pain
VanCleef: so i just hope he finds someone to truely love oneday
truffles: so ure his childhood friend from romania?
truffles: guess not
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 30 @ 0.00529999 = 0.159 BTC [-]
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo how's county jail ?
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30200 @ 0.0008449 = 25.516 BTC [-] {2}
ozbot: ConferenceCall.biz
ozbot: Bob Dylan - Isis (1976) on Vimeo
truffles: No man is an island, entire of itself; every man is a piece of the continent, a part of the main. If a clod be washed away by the sea, Europe is the less, as well as if promontory were, as well as if a manor of thy friend's or of thine own were. Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind; and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.
Vexual: my cigarette packet tells me australia is the smallest continent
truffles: why not look for quotes like that talking about empathy
truffles: bob dylans voice i dont like too much
mircea_popescu: truffles you know donne was mostly a satirist.
mircea_popescu: methinks you've been had.
truffles: he was a monk
truffles: that was hemmingway?
truffles: quote
mircea_popescu: no you illiterate lout, that was not hemingway.
truffles: no man is an island donne ya
mircea_popescu: the world existed before your shitty republic was founded five minutes ago
ozbot: jimi hendrix if 6 were 9 (rara avis version) - YouTube
mircea_popescu: and the world will exist just fine long after we won't even remember your shitty republic ever was
mircea_popescu: five minutes hence.
truffles: ;;google lout
gribble: Lout - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary: <http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/lout>; lout - definition of lout by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and ...: <http://www.thefreedictionary.com/lout>; Lout (software) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lout_(software)>
truffles: sure im pretty aggro
Vexual: its all the female hormone
Vexual: full lunar
truffles: il·lit·er·ate a person who is unable to read or write.
truffles: hmm i think we need to learn english
truffles: at least english vocabulary
mircea_popescu: being able to read or write doesn't make you literate any more than being able to css makes you a programmer.
truffles: if u want to change the meaning of predefined words go ahead
Vexual: im defo gonna buy that old italian storybook now i hear there is a newtranslation
mircea_popescu: i'm not changing it. i'm simply not acquiescing to the change you propose.
truffles: it is the incorrect word
mircea_popescu: herpderp.
Vexual: flange
mircea_popescu: ;;google literate
gribble: Literate - Merriam-Webster Online: <http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/literate>; Literacy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literacy>; Literate programming - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literate_programming>
mircea_popescu: look at the beauty of that, literate means educated, illiterate means "unable to read and write and strictly that".
mircea_popescu: how fascinating the world of ephemerides, seriously now.
truffles: which meaning are u trying to go for then
truffles: cuz google says its hemmingway
ozbot: CW Stoneking - Jungle Blues - YouTube
mircea_popescu: yes, well, google is probably able to read and write too, these days.
mircea_popescu: making it a paragon of contemporary literacy.
mircea_popescu: doesn't understand jack shit it's saying, but that's not part of the scoring card anymore.
truffles: "no man is an island" is by john donne
Vexual: 5-10,000 years huh mp?
truffles: i was going to use his quote but that hemingway version was better
Vexual: im jealous, i don't rememebr what happened last week
Vexual: how did a pharoah think?
truffles: theyre all dead
truffles: and tombs got raided on top of it
truffles: devine justice
Vexual: i dont think most arceaologists interested in egypt could answer that with any certainty
truffles: they went into hiding ?
Vexual: its not all eyeshadow and pussy, ill asure you that
ozbot: Maroon 5 - Moves Like Jagger on Vimeo
truffles: good soon
truffles: song*
Vexual: yeah you're not authorised to drink
truffles: Donne argued that it was better to examine carefully one's religious convictions than blindly to follow any established tradition, for none would be saved at the Final Judgment, by claiming "A Harry, or a Martin taught [them] this."
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.54 BTC [-]
truffles: "His images of sickness, vomit, manure, and plague reflected his strongly satiric view of a world populated by all the fools and knaves of England."
truffles: i see no contradiction with the "no man is an island"
ozbot: Auld Lang Syne || Lea Michele on Vimeo
truffles: i see the quote about the bell tolls, but the wording is different ldo
truffles: vexual u dont like utube anymore?
Vexual: anything google runs unusually slow for me
truffles: vimeo is slow for me so standard
truffles: did u understand the words she sang?
truffles: so muffled
ozbot: Bob Dylan - Thunder On The Mountain - YouTube
Vexual: "better roll your aeroplane down"
ozbot: Lea Michele - Cannonball - YouTube
truffles: is that jizz on his face :D
Vexual: cocaine, twas the 80s
ozbot: new york alicia keys - YouTube
truffles: i only like the chorus for that
truffles: oh nm tis is the one without jz
truffles: is that towards me
truffles: ????
ozbot: QUEEN IFRICA / Lioness on the Rise - YouTube
ozbot: Amy Winehouse - Back To Black - YouTube
ozbot: Amy Winehouse - Back To Black (Live Acoustic) - YouTube
truffles: lioness on teh rise not bad
Vexual: i would fuck her if she was alive
truffles: u have a type :D
Vexual: check you secktor fool
truffles: ive never had a type, i feel lucky
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7798 @ 0.00084945 = 6.624 BTC [+]
ozbot: Amy Winehouse - You Know I'm No Good - YouTube
ozbot: Melissa Etheridge - Piece of my heart - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 40 @ 0.00388 = 0.1552 BTC [+]
truffles: cant stay connected Diablo-D3?
Diablo-D3: xchat scrambled config
Diablo-D3: so Ive been resetting it
truffles: maybe get the stable mirc :D
truffles: why is she barefoot on stage
Vexual: hippy
truffles: posers
Vexual: nope its real
truffles: but i love her voice
Vexual: she doesnt need shoes or pubes
truffles: im talking about joss stone
ozbot: Joss Stone - "The High Road" LIVE Studio Session - YouTube
Vexual: yeah
truffles: oh no
truffles: she's got poshness
Vexual: she learnened soul at voice school
truffles: ill try to avoid hearing her speak, she was a good student if she learned that at skool
Vexual: she obviously had a particular aptitude
truffles: to convince some1 to go to her concert stead of metallica hmmm
Vexual: her hair is nicer
ozbot: Lady Sovereign - So Human - YouTube
truffles: not sure if like
Vexual: thats the idea
truffles: music must take u somewhere imo
Vexual: works better when you know shes abig ol lezzo
truffles: not for me
Vexual: you're a mupet
truffles: u mad
ozbot: Stone Roses - Fools Gold(Full Version) - YouTube
Vexual: handy on the skins
truffles: this is the beginning of decline for todays links isnt it
Vexual: sure
Vexual: kids are being born after bitcoin
ozbot: Thrift Shop Featuring Wanz - Macklemore and Ryan - Full with Lyrics (HD) - YouTube
Vexual: jurov if youve got youy hearing aid in this is outta time
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform:
mircea_popescu: anything short of programmable workfunction will lead to a cat'n'mouse game rather expensive and unproductively unpleasant for all involved. << i think you underestimate the prevalence of masochists in the bdsmitcoin community.
ozbot: Animaniacs Intro - YouTube
jurov: heh, reading that scrollback.. got an idea that maybe specifying sat solver itself as work function could work
mircea_popescu: jurov what, like recursxively ?
jurov: then one would spend coins to specify desired input to be combputed by solver
ozbot: Raketu - Sody Pop - YouTube
jurov: so, i'd broadcast a special transaction "whoever sat-solves this input will get these coins"
jurov: and miners would decide if they want to do it
jurov: once solved, it will be verifiable easily
mircea_popescu: but why stop there. make doom coin : the proof of work is sat-proving the actual coin codebase. all of it. including the pow part.
mircea_popescu: once a block ticks we know the world has just ended
jurov: yes, but you still need to break the problem into small parts for mining
jurov: to keep the spice flowing :)
jurov: and splitting the proof of whole codebase to manageable chunks might not be possible
Vexual: describing captcha?
Vexual: ignore me
mircea_popescu: jurov well that's why it's doomcoin. there can only be one.
ozbot: Neo EasyCoin Official - Buy BTC With Cash [UK,USA,Russia,Denmark,Sweden,Norway]
mircea_popescu: post #42, the answer to the big questions of life and everything else.
jurov: doomcoin would be like... postmined coin :)
Vexual: is not firedcat gonna allow trading of his company witht the last three digits on the blockchain?
KRS1: .bait
KRS1: ho siht
Vexual: or does friedcat have a little vex in him?
Vexual: i call flange
ozbot: Nicki Minaj - Stupid Hoe (Explicit) - Video Dailymotion
KRS1: HAH thats a good one! It's 0826 AM here and I'm blasting this song
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23199 @ 0.00085031 = 19.7263 BTC [+] {2}
KRS1: omg that ASS
Vexual: sheck speical alice on yfreecams
Vexual: very illegal
KRS1: i cant pull that up then
KRS1: oh thats the title
Vexual: dont she wont want a tatoo
KRS1: No Matches by Name
Vexual: imay have made it up
KRS1: =/
Vexual: ¬/
KRS1: wtf is up with BBW..who the fuck wants to see all that fat
Vexual: theres no accounting for taste or other humans
ozbot: The Bangles Walk Like An Egyptian - YouTube
ozbot: david bowie - changes - YouTube
ozbot: Primal Scream perform It's Alright It's OK - live session - YouTube
SNone: could someone give some pointers
Vexual: north brah
Vexual: if thats where youre headed
ozbot: paranoid black sabbath (lyrics included) - YouTube
Vexual: what do you want to know SNone?
Vexual: if you're mininging kanye west coin you need to add --scrypt
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 500 @ 0.001 = 0.5 BTC [+]
KRS1: Vexual ya played the wrong one cunt
ozbot: DAVID BOWIE - FAME [HQ] - YouTube
KRS1: Thats my shit right there. 70's disco, cocaine, yeah.
Vexual: thats on the desert island ipod
Vexual: miami business
KRS1: yea
KRS1: i need some coffee cant get started right this morning
KRS1: bbiaf
ozbot: Dizzee Rascal Holiday - Video Dailymotion
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04920201 = 0.246 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [MS] 65 @ 0.005 = 0.325 BTC {2}
ozbot: The Doors "Been Down So Long (Alternate Version)" - YouTube
ozbot: Method Man ft. Busta Rhymes - What's Happenin' *Uncensored* [Official video] - YouTube
ozbot: Nirvana - In Bloom - YouTube
KRS1: +1
KRS1: ;;lasers
gribble: ┌━ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ *pew!* *pew!* *pew!*
KRS1: guitars on that song are moving
KRS1: epitome of 90's grunge rock
Vexual: extra wizard
KRS1: and i consider nirvana late to the game
Vexual: *scoff*
KRS1: i think jane's addiction might have kicked that shit off in the 80's even
ozbot: Aeon Flux Opening - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 27812 @ 0.00008539 = 2.3749 BTC [+] {13}
ozbot: 1990. Jane's Addiction - Been Caught Stealing HQ - YouTube
KRS1: That actually came out in 1989
KRS1: i remember aeon flux
KRS1: opening was the best
KRS1: prolly the only anime i can tolerate
Vexual: i saw the garbage girl with her tits out at big day out
Vexual: its enough to get a man into s&m
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 8 @ 0.049202 = 0.3936 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.0492 = 0.246 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.54200001 = 1.084 BTC [+] {2}
ozbot: Machine Gun Fellatio Mojo Pumpin' (4 of 6) - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.55497997 = 1.11 BTC [+]
Vexual: these guys are motorhead
ozbot: machine gun fellatio - mutha fukka on a motorcycle - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.54200001 BTC [-]
Vexual: im pretty sure pankkake has a bikini kill sticker on his 100 mile an hour shiity citron
Vexual: whereby the shock absorbers cost more than the car and everythink is ok
ozbot: Tracy Chapman Fast Car Remix - YouTube
ozbot: Daft Punk - Around The World - YouTube
ozbot: Joni Mitchell-California (BBC) - YouTube
Vexual: poobot
Diablo-D3: motorhead is considered good now? =/
Vexual: if you consider my consideration
ozbot: Music Auld Lang Syne ~ Royal Scots Dragoon Guards. - YouTube
Diablo-D3: a little late for that
ozbot: Celtic Woman - Symphony Tour - Auld Lang Syne - YouTube
Vexual: The first Noel
truffles: xmas was last month
ozbot: How to Pronounce Ben Nevis - YouTube
ozbot: The Straits | ABC1 | Full Trailer: Thursdays, 8.30pm - YouTube
Vexual: hi devthedev
devthedev: What's this chan for?
jurov: ;;topic
gribble: http://bitcoin-assets.com || http://log.bitcoin-assets.com - most days worth reading || http://bash.bitcoin-assets.com - all days worth reading
Vexual: whatvever the kako syas
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 642 @ 0.001 = 0.642 BTC [+]
ozbot: Shipping companies largely silent on NSA interceptions | The Daily Caller
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19910 @ 0.00084341 = 16.7923 BTC [-] {2}
Vexual: small scale surface shipping would work with bc
Vexual: who charts oil/bc?
ozbot: [Mpex.co] The biggest scam in bitcoin history?
mircea_popescu: this is pretty great.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2000 @ 0.00009 = 0.18 BTC [+]
Vexual: you're so not scammy, i think if you ever got into shiping you wouldnt even poke paris
Vexual: well, you're still not scammy
Vexual: i bet i can make jimmoth have an anuerism
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 390 @ 0.00048998 = 0.1911 BTC [+]
Vexual: wait jimmothy is kill?
pankkake: Vexual: Citroën*
pankkake: lol the cloudhashing customers took a lot of time to get they were scammed
pankkake: who would even trust something with "cloud" in it
jurov: pankkake are you going to follow that promise?
Vexual: pankakke i have my kb set wronh i vant even find@
Vexual: 2bc/gh
pankkake: what promise?
Vexual: how scam is it?
Vexual: is it tre scammy?
KRS1: we have a scam scale now? I thought if scam > 0 | > /dev/null
Vexual: cannes selection never show the wife going direct to the madhouse
Vexual: mps old book probably cover the matter'
Vexual: he scammed his wife
pankkake: hehe I spammed your blog jurov too
Vexual: shes devo and needs help
jurov: i overtook you
mircea_popescu: devthedev this chan is for discussing bitcoin finance.
Vexual: shit
devthedev: I failed earlier and sent .25BTC to the wrong address, lol
Vexual: is the iminent monsoon relevant?
jurov: Vexual, time to reset the markov chain?
mircea_popescu: explo.yt ? not a bad name
Vexual: well i think monsoon is relevant to finance through the ages
ozbot: 1789546951.05324 | Next Diff in 1768 blocks | Estimated Change: 13.5349% in 10d 14h 40m 2s
Vexual: it may be time to lock the cellar
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 1789546951.05324 * 1.135349
gribble: 2031760341.33
mircea_popescu: holy shit within 2%
Vexual: what is this calculation?
Vexual: diff?
jurov: Vexual: next difficulty estimate
jurov: ;;seen benkay
gribble: benkay was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 day, 11 hours, 45 minutes, and 3 seconds ago: <benkay> simply accept that they have a bigger stick than you and so can
mircea_popescu: it's all because of that 2bn bet
Vexual: when does it solve?
KRS1: you cache has a problem mp
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 3 @ 0.09016666 = 0.2705 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 500 @ 0.00290648 = 1.4532 BTC [-] {8}
jurov: it closes Feb 28 iirc
Vexual: so its yes?
KRS1: check varnish jurov
jurov: yes. then there are 5.6bn on March 31 and 14bn on July 14
KRS1: maybe backend
mircea_popescu: KRS1 what's it do ?
jurov: KRS1: you mean the blog?
KRS1: 503
Vexual: half price furys delivered in 2 days
KRS1: yeh
jurov: it's gandi's shit.. too lazy to host it myself properly
mircea_popescu: i see it ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 250 @ 0.00288614 = 0.7215 BTC [-] {3}
ozbot: Down For Everyone Or Just Me -> Check if your website is down or up?
jurov: no KRS meant my blog
mircea_popescu: o. i see that too
jurov: mhm :(
mircea_popescu: i was actually reading through it right nao
KRS1: looks like a timeout value or something is amiss
Apocalyptic: http://explo.yt/ works fine for me
jurov: they had some hosting problems today
jurov: we'll see if that persists
KRS1: carrier grade network problems aside, it amazes me hosting companies can't have 100% uptime
Vexual: your network never goes down?
diametric: KRS1: even Tier 1 providers ultimately do maintenance
KRS1: i have a friend who hosts out of a small datacenter in texas..he has the choice of like 8 different providers and can fail over at any time
diametric: but nobody is going to say 100%, but a lot of them have 4-5 9's
KRS1: diametric agreed
jurov: because PHP
mircea_popescu: it's not economical to get 100% anything.
diametric: Also large datacenters are managed poorly. I used to work for Digex, which was then bought by Worldcom, and then bought by Verizon.
mircea_popescu: you could have a dedicated 10gbit pipe for your blog. that wouldn't be 100%, it'd be "all those instances when you get hit with less than 10gbps"
KRS1: there are 100%'ers out there..in fact I think its quite common for hosting servers..not necessarily php applications though
diametric: The shit show that went on there was amazing
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
mircea_popescu: diametric what they do ?
diametric: mircea_popescu: top tier hosting, we hosted all of JP Morgans main infrastructure, USPS, Ford Motor Company, tons of big players. We one had a janitor take out an entire farm because he backed his mop handle into the emergency power stop switch
Vexual: i remmeber all my isps log were available and mistyped passwords got logged
mircea_popescu: this sounds like dilbert
diametric: Unix Tech Ops would routine fuck in the datacenters too
KRS1: mircea_popescu I'm specifically talking uptime, not throughput though..your servers should always be accessible..hosting php apps, application level hosting however, is a completely different situation and agreed, almost impossible to host applicactions with 100% availability
diametric: routinely*
mircea_popescu: so what's wrong with dc fucking ?
KRS1: .bait
diametric: haha
mircea_popescu: KRS1 well yes, but it quickly becomes an academic point. "system is online, it does nothing but reply to pings"
KRS1: I'd fuck that in a datacenter
KRS1: well with OS availability, ssh, for instance
diametric: KRS1: a lot of top tier 1 providers throw hissy fits too.
diametric: Like Cogent de-peers with people every week
diametric: Level3 and Cogent feud constantly
mircea_popescu: what else are they do to ? think : if they fucked in each other's dcs more...
ozbot: DIS IZ WHY I'M HOT (zef remix) - Die Antwoord - YouTube
ozbot: [ANN] A Challenger Appears: SKYPIEA, a Privacy-Friendly Exchange
mircea_popescu: by all accounts the privacy-friendly exchange eloped with about 350k worth of elopement-friendly dollars of naive customers'
Vexual: who?
KRS1: diametric so are you saying? Customers at each datacenter in your example are cut off?
Vexual: i like the phrase elopement friendly
ozbot: Gavin will visit the Council on Foreign Relations
diametric: KRS1: if Tier 1 providers de-peer from each other it could result in partial outages
mircea_popescu: well temporary bad routes at least
diametric: yeah
mircea_popescu: diametric you and dub should be friends.
KRS1: what mircea_popescu sounds more reasonable, I've been the victim of that too, where some of my customers were able to reach my hosts, but not others
diametric: mircea_popescu: i have no idea who that is
KRS1: thats up to that DC staff to fix with their providers
KRS1: but temporary outages..no
diametric: KRS1: yeah, but would you really call that 100% uptime?
KRS1: bad routes yes
diametric: I mean some people would I guess
mircea_popescu: diametric he's a guy working in a dc, seeing it with exactly the same eyes
diametric: but then once you attach exceptions like that, your definition of 100% is kind of bunk anyway.
diametric: mircea_popescu: ahh, well its been many years since I worked in that space. I left it around 2004
mircea_popescu: only a dictator would want 100% uptime anyway.
KRS1: diametric bad routes are not the fault of the datacenter, but the network provider connecting to them dude
diametric: mircea_popescu: you'd be surprised the SLAs some customers demand
KRS1: mircea_popescu its not uncommon for requests, and provision of 100% uptime
mircea_popescu: being one of those customers...
diametric: haha
KRS1: application level (php hosting for instance) is out of the question i think
mircea_popescu: for instance : i get first dibs on any piece of hardware replaced-as-broken anywhere on the pipe to my machines
diametric: KRS1: from the customers point of view it doesn't matter. They don't want to hear why your provider has issues, they want to know why you didn't anticipate them and have alternatives in place to mitigate it.
diametric: which is why you rarely see anyone offer 100% uptime, it just opens you up to fail
KRS1: diametric i see 100% uptime guarantee quite often.
KRS1: Idk..I've been doing this almost 20 years, I could be wrong though.
diametric: I'm sure its 100% (*)
KRS1: of course
diametric: (*) [ insert list of reasons that don't count as downtime ]
Vexual: not an actual guarantee
ozbot: Die Antwoord - Rich Bitch - YouTube
KRS1: +1 to Vexual for leet Die Antwoord selections
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 18000 @ 0.001 = 18 BTC [+]
gesell1: what tha? I received an API key email from btct.co, anyone else?
gesell1: thought btct was shutdown
mircea_popescu: buncha people got them. i don't recall what the reason was supposed to be
KRS1: access to historical data, trades.
mircea_popescu: i wonder what happens should anyone claim they didn't do X trade now.
KRS1: ya it was kinda like that ugly girlfriend from the past (read: a moped) that shows her ugly face again in front of your friends
mircea_popescu: not like there's receipts or anything, website model.
Vexual: yeah i dint sell all that am at 5
Vexual: i wont my muny back
mircea_popescu: what's am anymore ?
mircea_popescu: does it even still trade ?
Vexual: fliedpuus
Vexual: no
mircea_popescu: i remember all the "omg asicminer is the biggest ting ever" back this summer.
Vexual: how much did you get if yuo helf since forum?
Vexual: *held
Vexual: not 5 i guess
KRS1: chaang noi was all over that
Vexual: n he wasnt
Vexual: he was bust already
Vexual: *busy lol
mircea_popescu: doing like 5-10 btc a day. holy shit what happened to bitcoin's star non-mpex corp ? are they actually in the shitter ?
Vexual: theres worse places to be
mircea_popescu: depends who you're there with
Vexual: perhaps one has an apricot farm
mircea_popescu: an all-girls highschool shitter may be a great place to smoke. the bitcoin shitter is full of retards.
Vexual: gotta pay 1 euro to get in too
Vexual: or is it 5 euro cents?
Vexual: i was broke wehn i went to the continent
Vexual: mp gets you into the highschool for zero
Apocalyptic: pankkake, are you watching Hollande's speech ?
Apocalyptic: it's disastrous...
pankkake: I don't follow politics at all
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1000 @ 0.0028572 = 2.8572 BTC [-] {6}
pankkake: from what I understand our compatriots are caring about his personal life now… what the fuck
gesell1: fgesell
Apocalyptic: it diverts the attention from important matters
pankkake: yeah, like get your dick sucked by your secretary and so you can bomb foreign countries
Vexual: yay fiat
Apocalyptic: he's almost stuttering and his voice is quite high
Vexual: musolini
Apocalyptic: confidence -> 0
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 1000 @ 0.001 = 1 BTC [+]
Vexual: "sody pop"
mircea_popescu: pankkake> from what I understand our compatriots are caring about his personal life now… what the fuck << gotta keep up with les americains
pankkake: while being so pround of not being like them
pankkake: proud*
Apocalyptic: that's gone long ago
mircea_popescu: ;;google Julie Gayet nude
gribble: 14 Julie Gayet Nude Photos - Francois Hollande's Mistress Girlfriend?: <http://www.everyjoe.com/2014/01/10/entertainment/julie-gayet-nude-photos-francois-hollande-mistress-girlfriend/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+b5media%2Feveryjoe+(EveryJoe)>; The sexually charged screen roles of Julie Gayet, Francois - Daily Mail: (1 more message)
Apocalyptic: now he's saying that not having a CDI at 25 years is unacceptable...
Apocalyptic: lol, surreal
mircea_popescu: what's a cdi ?
ozbot: Lil Kim Music Video 14 The Rain by Missy Elliott 1997 - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.55499779 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: "Watch: Everything you need to know about the French president's love life"
Apocalyptic: mircea, it's a job contract for an undetermined timeframe, very hard to break for the employers
mircea_popescu: bwahahaha why the fuck do i need to know anything about some grasshopper-headed frenchie socialist.
Vexual: lol
Apocalyptic: basically the holly grail of employement in France
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.555 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: they have those here too. except they're very easy to terminate.
KRS1: .bait
KRS1: jackpot
pankkake: honestly I like the CDD (which has a duration) better. it's actually harder to break, well until it ends of course
mircea_popescu: this is a point. pretty much the only way to terminate those is to pay up
mircea_popescu: sort-of like a pay-or-play contract works in the us.
pankkake: sadly you can only have the same CDD only 2 or 3 times
mircea_popescu: "16.34 So how will the French react to Francois Hollande's refusal to answer questions about whether Valerie Trierweiler is still the First Lady?
mircea_popescu: Remember 77 per cent of French people recently surveyed say his private life is of no concern to them."
mircea_popescu: i'm glad you mentioned this. absolute textbook study in how teh press doth not matter at all.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 6 @ 0.55999728 = 3.36 BTC [+] {5}
mircea_popescu: herpderp " Impatience is growing among some, as he continues to discuss foreign and domestic policy..." derpyderp the public does not care so here's some more of the retarded shit that preoccupies us"
Vexual: tat is missing
ozbot: Lil' Kim & Phil Collins - In The Air Tonite (HD / Dirty) - YouTube
pankkake: it's quite funny that while he's probably annoyed about the attention on his private life, he also approved a law so that we can have our own NSA
mircea_popescu: i don't quite understand why politicians still maintain the facade that the press people are like... people.
Apocalyptic: pankkake, he already have it for a long time I thinl
Apocalyptic: *think
mircea_popescu: it stands to reason you'd talk to them as if they were sorta obnoxious teenager at best
mircea_popescu: mentally retarded generally.
pankkake: I think they do it already
Apocalyptic: what's the DST to you if not our NSA ?
Vexual: imagine yourself as a politician
pankkake: yeah well the law is basically approving things that existed already, but were illegal
mircea_popescu: Vexual i'd have two nuns, one on each side. the left one'd carry the soap, the right one the ruler.
Vexual: you watched black lagoon
mircea_popescu: and the press conference'd start with a nails and handkerchief examination.
pankkake: which is actually one of the "justifications" for the law. "we're doing it already". lol
pankkake: in France journalists are basically employed by the politicians. they give interviews to whoever they want, they subsidize their crap no one wants to read, etc.
Vexual: and judges complain theres nothing to read
Vexual: buy time and call it a day
ozbot: N.E.R.D. - Everyone Nose - YouTube
Vexual: femme actualle
pankkake: and that's only direct subsidies, anything bought by high schools etc. isn't accounted for
Vexual: you think you waste money?
Vexual: hoi
Vexual: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lZefsii1K0 krs1 this is for all your pole dancers
ozbot: Willie Nelson - Blue Eyes Crying In The Rain - Midnight Special 1980 HQ - YouTube
Vexual: you be nice to those gils
Vexual: or il come and poke a crocodile up your arse
Vexual: and they're infinitly more motile than alligators
Vexual: anyone who thinks i sound violent might like to taste the irony
mike_c: isn't it a bit early to be wasted vex?
Vexual: 3am here
mike_c: oh
ozbot: KLF - 3 a m eternal (Complete) - YouTube
Vexual: 41 degrees celcius and 65 percent humidity
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 22968 @ 0.001 = 22.968 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 29769 @ 0.001 = 29.769 BTC [+] {2}
ozbot: N.W.A. - Fab 5 Freddie & N.W.A. in Manhattan - New York City (1991) - YouTube
ozbot: Dr Dre ft. Snoop Dogg - Still D.R.E - YouTube
ozbot: Snoop Dogg Ft Pharrell - Beautiful HD - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 2000 @ 0.00008585 = 0.1717 BTC [-]
Vexual: 10bc the shit should be in jamacia
ozbot: Damian Marley - Welcome to Jamrock ( Lyrics ) - YouTube
ozbot: Lee "Scratch" Perry - Pum Pum - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.55999999 BTC [+]
ozbot: Norah Jones - Summertime - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 6944 @ 0.00009039 = 0.6277 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 1 @ 0.102 BTC [+]
ozbot: Bob Dylan - Isis (1976) on Vimeo
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.0491 = 0.1473 BTC [-] {3}
ozbot: Arlo Guthrie - Coming Into Los Angeles (live 1969) HD 0815007 - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 6 @ 0.04893333 = 0.2936 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.0485 = 0.2425 BTC [-]
ozbot: Billy Bunks - Strumpets - YouTube
ozbot: Cross Bred Mongrels - Overgrown Town - YouTube
ozbot: Hilltop hoods- dumb enough - YouTube
ozbot: Black Eyed Peas My Humps Outro "So Real" Cleanly Edited Extended Version - YouTube
mod6: ;;bc,stats
gribble: Current Blocks: 280485 | Current Difficulty: 1.7895469510532405E9 | Next Difficulty At Block: 282239 | Next Difficulty In: 1754 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 4 days, 5 hours, 50 minutes, and 46 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 2018000299.28 | Estimated Percent Change: 12.76599
Vexual: 5milly
Vexual: 20
mircea_popescu: it keeps slimming out, was 203mn last
Vexual: lol
Vexual: next halving maybe
Vexual: millions arent what they were
Vexual: just like my memory
truffles: dont worry nsa got that covered digitally :D
Vexual: yo dawg i herd you liked deniro http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QRRJpJIcaT4
truffles: still going strong with the music
Vexual: no im starting to see 50 hetz
Vexual: delerium tremors
Vexual: tremens
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 200 @ 0.00508637 = 1.0173 BTC [-] {11}
jurov: delirium
Vexual: that too
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 200 @ 0.00506405 = 1.0128 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 224 @ 0.00387999 = 0.8691 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 970 @ 0.0028562 = 2.7705 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 77 @ 0.00283753 = 0.2185 BTC [-] {3}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1291 @ 0.00280155 = 3.6168 BTC [-] {6}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 500 @ 0.001 = 0.5 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 255 @ 0.0028 = 0.714 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 55 @ 0.00280001 = 0.154 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 179 @ 0.0028 = 0.5012 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 110 @ 0.00279 = 0.3069 BTC [-] {2}
ozbot: Silverchair - Tomorrow - YouTube
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 90 @ 0.00278 = 0.2502 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HIF] 795 @ 0.00048998 = 0.3895 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17000 @ 0.00084234 = 14.3198 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 299 @ 0.00277 = 0.8282 BTC [-] {4}
ozbot: Silverchair - Israel's Son (Live @ MuchMusic) - YouTube
pankkake: silverchair is gay
Vexual: he smokes bong with our politicians with no sex
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 2700 @ 0.00270519 = 7.304 BTC [-] {7}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 106 @ 0.002705 = 0.2867 BTC [-]
Vexual: bono was there too
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 4 @ 0.02694696 = 0.1078 BTC [-]
Vexual: and now when they ask who you'd go gay for, you can say silverchair]
ozbot: Silver Chair - Suicidal Dreams (Live at Much Music) - YouTube
jurov: lol so supposedly MPEx "is designed to mesmerize potential users, making them invest lots of time (that old chestnut), and confuse them into losing their BTC; all-the-while awarding a sense of superiority."
Vexual: soulds like marketing genius
pankkake: best criticism to date on that thread though
Vexual: an users in the thread?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 159 @ 0.00264979 = 0.4213 BTC [-] {5}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 1000 @ 0.001 = 1 BTC [+]
Vexual: obviously youre ther with your clever quiffs pankkakke
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 400 @ 0.00256434 = 1.0257 BTC [-] {9}
jurov: nah, he's only paid troll
pankkake: what's a quiff? isn't it a pussy fart?
Vexual: youre always on like donkey kong
pankkake: I have utterly failed to monetize my trolling
Vexual: i don tknow, i think its a hairstyle and i misused the term
pankkake: hopefully at the end of the month I'll have a better health and will do actual stuff
Vexual: now you're channeling me
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 59 @ 0.00388 = 0.2289 BTC [+]
Vexual: im gonna give dr greg a mouthful just coz hes a fuckwit
Vexual: and his shut stinks
ozbot: Silverchair - Shade (Live @ Cambridge Hotel 95) - YouTube
Vexual: and ive got the patent on stinky shit
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 40 @ 0.04627854 = 1.8511 BTC [-] {10}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 42 @ 0.0037 = 0.1554 BTC [-] {2}
Vexual: seriously that guy is a fucking bannaa
pankkake: why?
Vexual: the only reason he has a phd is because noone watnted too read his hsit anymore
Vexual: hes a karate expert with a soe back, doesnt compute
mike_c: new website announcement. assbot thinks its amazing.
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
mike_c: for those not afraid of a little javascript, a mpex option P/L tool:
Vexual: anytime he fucks up he blames his tools
ozbot: Option Analysis - Btc Alpha
mike_c: and an overview page for mpex stocks:
ozbot: S.MPOE Analysis - Btc Alpha
mike_c: not as much javascript, a blog post:
pankkake: nice
ozbot: When Does BitBet Money Come In? - Btc Alpha
Duffer1: ya looks great
mike_c: thanks. please send bug reports/suggestions.
Vexual: is it ever gonna be 1.0?
mircea_popescu: i'm unemployed, mods please clean up my mess. i'm a quick study, believe me when i say so, pay no mind to the fact i can't be fucking bothered to figure out where my post goes
mircea_popescu: mike_c o your blog ?
mike_c: blog is a piece of it, yeah. inaugural post is up.
kakobrekla: nice find mike_c
kakobrekla: a your stuff.
jurov: what is "correct price"?
Vexual: hanna has nice tits
ozbot: FAQ - Btc Alpha
Duffer1: vex proof?
mike_c: Garman-Kohlhagen
Vexual: just bitcointalk avatar
Vexual: if i put a picture on there ill have my shirt open
pankkake: mike_c: rss feed would be nice
pankkake: for the blog
mike_c: yeah, thanks. i'll add one.
Vexual: yall know blog are gay right?
pankkake: wrong
Vexual: u wanna be a pimp, monetise usenet
mike_c: blog is just a piece, if you use mpex hopefully the tools are useful.
Vexual: im just jealous
Vexual: my website is one jpeg and 3 links
Vexual: no rss coz it never changes
kakobrekla: as long as it has css you are good
Vexual: its kinda htm 1.0
Vexual: and no longer existanty
Vexual: i know theres more punters since 92
pankkake: http://headfucking.net/ probably my favorite css ever written
ozbot: headfucking.net
pankkake: and no images
jurov: mike_c i can't wrap my head about shorting puts, how is the profit computed there?
jurov: 100% means you will get all your investment back?
Vexual: thats yours huh pankkake?
mike_c: 100% means if you sell puts for 1btc you will keep it all
mike_c: calculation: is.. strike / (1 + price) i think for value of put. lemme check
Vexual: .bait
Diablo-D3: sad they're fake
Vexual: b&w
mike_c: put value = (strike/spot - 1). so when you sell, your profit is whatever you got for the sale minus that.
jurov: it makes little sense if you don't put collateral into picture
mike_c: as far as ROI you mean
mike_c: ROI is different from profit, but yeah, that would be helpful.
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I'll find out in two days, maybe.
mike_c: one thing i think it helps with is finding the most profitable strike given an 'expected price'.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04999997 = 0.25 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 20000 @ 0.001 = 20 BTC [+]
jurov: yes, it does
jurov: in ff after selecting and unselecting several rows, i'm getting error in highcharts code
mike_c: hm. thanks, i'll investigate.
ozbot: People have made blogs pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
mike_c: thanks mp!
pizzaman1337: nice site mike_c
jurov: yup
mircea_popescu: now we need some girls to make blogs too
mircea_popescu: or - gasp - black people.
pizzaman1337: where's MPOE-PR's blog? :P
jurov: put that into niggers.txt
mircea_popescu: pizzaman1337 she had one but can't hardly be arsed to update it iirc
jurov: thewhet.net
mircea_popescu: http://www.btcalpha.com/blog/2014/when-does-bitbet-money-come-in/ << this actually is exactly what i mean by fucking research.
ozbot: When Does BitBet Money Come In? - Btc Alpha
mike_c: i was surprised by the results too
mircea_popescu: i wasn't cause i have them, but the fact is there's so much counterintuitive if not outright fucking weird shit going on in btc
mircea_popescu: that really the lukewarm derpage people waste their time with is a sore waste.
mircea_popescu: mike_c "as well as the starting wager of whoever created the bet." is this sound ?
mike_c: i didn't want it to throw off the results. what i wanted to see was whether other people are being attracted to bets early.
kakobrekla: how about adding a weight adjusted line to that chart, plain linear?
pizzaman1337: imo that curve is a result of the "new bets" and "closing soon" sections on the left hand side. More visibility, more bets.
mike_c: i also ran the numbers bucketing by weight instead of by time, but it gets weird because bets can close early when there is still a high weight.
mircea_popescu: yes but see, a large part of late action is rebalancing of odds either according to new developments or others positioning.
pizzaman1337: that too
mircea_popescu: and since it's impossible to take out later readjustments of the bettor, you can't really take out his original stake either. course i suppose what exactly you're trying to see
mike_c: i have the numbers with those bets in as well. not as different as you would think. the sum of btc isn't that high.
mircea_popescu: i know (and for that matter house bets don't change much either)
mircea_popescu: more arguing for the principle of the thing than anything
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 132 @ 0.001 = 0.132 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: pizzaman1337 didn't you have a blog btw ?
mircea_popescu: jborkl's kinda been neglecting his
BingoBoingo: I think benkay just started one http://cascadianhacker.com/index.html
pizzaman1337: mircea_popescu: I used to log/chart mpex prices, but then the spread on options got too high for me, so I stopped maintaining it
mircea_popescu: ah right
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 5000 @ 0.00008601 = 0.4301 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 2000 @ 0.001 = 2 BTC [+]
ozbot: Paleo in Portland
mircea_popescu: it IS his.
mircea_popescu: well, in the pot it goes.
mircea_popescu: this guy's been posting like an animal too
Apocalyptic: anyone maintaining some blog related to btc finance ?
mircea_popescu: Apocalyptic mike_c for instance, discussed above
Apocalyptic: I saw a discussion about it yeah, he wanted to go for a code afaik
mircea_popescu: im sure the "bitcoin finance" blogspace is not saturated now,
mircea_popescu: nor will it ever be
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 6575 @ 0.001 = 6.575 BTC [+]
mike_c: mine is probably limited by the fact that i don't intend to waste time dissecting the scams.
Apocalyptic: "bitcoin finance" quality blogspace won't that's for sure
mircea_popescu: kinda what i meant.
jurov: ;;prevdiffchange
jurov: ;;diffchange
gribble: 26.15935
gribble: Estimated percent change in difficulty this period | 12.24051 % based on data since last change | 16.09483 % based on data for last three days
ozbot: 1789546951.05324 | Next Diff in 1741 blocks | Estimated Change: 12.1541% in 10d 14h 49m 22s
mircea_popescu: it's kind-of plumeting
mircea_popescu: ;;calc 1789546951.05324* 1.121541
gribble: 2007050277.03
mircea_popescu: at this rate...
pizzaman1337: that bitbet should be exciting
mircea_popescu: im curious if the no's will start pouring in now
kakobrekla: ill bitbet it wont
kakobrekla: bitbet doesnt do negative bets, so bet must be it will pour in
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 153 @ 0.00256 = 0.3917 BTC [-] {2}
kakobrekla: so if you put 100 on wont and 100 on no
kakobrekla: you can still lose
kakobrekla: since you put 200 on one side
kakobrekla: just dont start a butthurt fb page after you fuck up!
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 45 @ 0.00254332 = 0.1144 BTC [-] {6}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 17 @ 0.54111766 = 9.199 BTC [-] {7}
Apocalyptic: nice blog mike_c, looking forward to the "Non-equity investments" anlysis
Apocalyptic: *analysis
mike_c: thanks! it won't be long.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 288 @ 0.00247982 = 0.7142 BTC [-] {6}
Apocalyptic: are you involved in finance irl ?
pizzaman1337: is btc not irl?
kakobrekla: im sure he pays the monthly b ills
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 210 @ 0.00243 = 0.5103 BTC [-] {2}
mike_c: i have a serious interest in gambling. I include finance under that category.
Apocalyptic: pizzaman1337, i obviously meant fiat-base finance instruments
mike_c: my day job is engineering.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 1000 @ 0.00243 = 2.43 BTC [-] {2}
mircea_popescu: gambling and finance are strictly distinct.
mircea_popescu: finance is shorthand for resource allocation. gambling is shorthand for risk pricing
mircea_popescu: these two activities are often found jointly in nature, like any house building will involve carpentry and masonry
mircea_popescu: nevertheless, they have nothing at all in common.
Apocalyptic: mircea, wait, you're saying risk pricing isn't a subdomain of finance ?
mircea_popescu: that's what i'm saying.
Apocalyptic: i've always included the latter in the former somehow
mircea_popescu: why do you think bankers fail so miserabl,y at it ?
mircea_popescu: it works both ways, gamblers are notoriously bad at keeping the bills paid in time
mircea_popescu: even if they do have the money. they "forget" or whateverthefuck.
mike_c: but not by definition. there are gamblers that are responsible with money.
mike_c: like phil hellmuth
mircea_popescu: just mental tendencies.
mircea_popescu: obviously people being people there'l;l be exceptions to any stereotype
mike_c: so you are saying gambling=carpentry and finance=house building. in that case, i am interested in the carpentry aspect of finance.
mircea_popescu: nothin' wrong with that.
mike_c: although that is probably pigeon-holing it a bit.
benkay: what in this metaphor is the practice of acquiring capital?
mircea_popescu: did hellmuth actually win any one wsop/wsoe main event ?
mircea_popescu: benkay what is this practice ?
mike_c: he was youngest main event winner for a long time
mircea_popescu: o he's the guy that beat up chan nm
mircea_popescu: yeah it came to me
Apocalyptic: mike_c, wasn't that phil lakk ?
benkay: some people practice risk management, right? and others practice 'finance' (whatever that is) - carpentry and housebuilding. but what about simply acquiring power and wealth?
Apocalyptic: or whatever his lastname is spelled
mike_c: no, he won at 24
ozbot: Phil Hellmuth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
mike_c: industrialists acquire wealth, they are not financiers.
benkay: mike_c: where's the btc alpha feed?
mircea_popescu: benkay well what about it ?
benkay: rss/atom
mike_c: no rss feed yet. coming this week.
mircea_popescu: anyway, the hellmuth guy, i recall this horrible loss to a romanian player, who had called a re-raise with a low pair or something
mircea_popescu: hellmuth folded a walking back to huston arrangement and then got all pissy
mike_c: yeah, his nickname is the poker brat for a reason.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33750 @ 0.00084307 = 28.4536 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 127 @ 0.0028473 = 0.3616 BTC [+] {8}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.53100003 BTC [-]
ozbot: Phil Hellmuth outburst vs a Romanian at WSOP 2008 - YouTube
TomServo: in case anyone else was curious
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 22 @ 0.00501005 = 0.1102 BTC [-] {4}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 25 @ 0.04575999 = 1.144 BTC [-] {6}
Duffer1: other than being unprofessional is there some extra meaning or penalty for name calling?
mike_c: tournament director can give you a time penalty, making you sit out for awhile and get blinded off.
Apocalyptic: thx for the link TomServo
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 1500 @ 0.001 = 1.5 BTC [+]
dub: what it is
TomServo: Micropayments for digital publishers.
mike_c: paywall for content. like tinypass.
Apocalyptic: like trilema credits
Apocalyptic: oh wait
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 38 @ 0.005 = 0.19 BTC [-] {4}
thestringpuller: lol I have like 10k trilema credits
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23077 @ 0.00084307 = 19.4555 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [COG.F2] 1 @ 0.6 BTC [+]
Duffer1: so apparently kanye has named amazon.com in his suit against anonymous coinye devs
ozbot: Kanye West Sues -- STOP USING MY FACE ... On Virtual Currency | TMZ.com
wao-ender: BIT gains $61M in investments?
wao-ender: The Bitcoin Investment Trust has proved to be popular, raising $61.1m from investors within three months of its launch.
Apocalyptic: wow indeed
pankkake: lol at the fish coin
the20year: where is BIT listed?
Duffer1: sounds fiat
the20year: BIT has to do with second market?
the20year: yeah , secondmarket is huge
mircea_popescu: TomServo yup thats the one
TomServo: he's such a bitch
benkay: hey tomservo do you like fish sticks?
ozbot: Fishsticks joke on kanye west - YouTube
TomServo: heh, I don't get it!
TomServo: haha, #coinyecoin just got cleared
TomServo: (CLEAR USERS used by coinyewest)
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.53100002 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 8500 @ 0.001 = 8.5 BTC [+]
KRS1: .bait
KRS1: .bait
KRS1: eww..sweat
KRS1: .bait
KRS1: .bait
KRS1: If anyone wants to come and meet me and come to the North American Bitcoin Conference:
ozbot: North American Bitcoin Conference
KRS1: Miami Beach is beautiful almost year round.
the20year: and who are you?
KRS1: How do I answer that? You want my first name? First and last?
KRS1: I don't have a title like Duke or anything.
mircea_popescu: what's with this "we're organising a conference next week" thing
KRS1: Idk just found the link myself.
Apocalyptic: <KRS1> I don't have a title like Duke or anything. // a shame really
Apocalyptic: I met Duke jurov a week ago
jurov: Duke?
KRS1: Haha
KRS1: It would be cool to be a Count though.
KRS1: Maybe wear a cape in the winter.
KRS1: Pretty much warm year round in Mimai though, and I'd look funny.
Apocalyptic: you wouldn't blend well in Miami yeah
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 30000 @ 0.001 = 30 BTC [+]
mike_c: per request:
ozbot: Btc Alpha Blog
benkay: what are you driving that with, mike_c?
Duffer1: subscribed
mike_c: mostly django
mike_c: thanks duffer
benkay: ditch it man
mike_c: for what?
benkay: django just lost bdfl
Apocalyptic: python rules
mike_c: again?
benkay: mhm.
mike_c: omg. what a pain.
ozbot: Adrian and Jacob retiring as Django BDFLs | Holovaty.com
benkay: speaking as someone who ekes out the odd food credit derping on django, shit has no future.
benkay: python has hella robust data science and robust outsider community, but man the web story is fn sad
Apocalyptic: I would use pyweb then
Duffer1: soo unsubscribe? hehe
mike_c: hehe. nah. django is a great accelerator. lot of out-of-the-box stuff that works well. like that rss-generator.
kakobrekla: it fails in opera
mike_c: the feed?
benkay: i'd hazard that the bitcoin alpha biz req's are a little different from my deploy
kakobrekla: but hey rss sux
kakobrekla: no wonder the author commited suicide
Duffer1: ouch
pankkake: Atom is better, yes
kakobrekla: json and gtfo
pankkake: well, that json feeds would be nice. write a spec and patch software!
pankkake: -that
kakobrekla: i dont want to commit suicide down the lane.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12400 @ 0.00084035 = 10.4203 BTC [-] {2}
mike_c: ;;later tell kakobrekla does this one work for you? http://www.btcalpha.com/feed/atom/
gribble: The operation succeeded.
pankkake: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=350103.msg4515286#msg4515286 jimmothy must read #bitcoin-assets since he said options are gambling
ozbot: [Mpex.co] The biggest scam in bitcoin history?
Apocalyptic: mike_c, regarding your BitBet and MPex analysis on btcalpha, you claim these are "zero-asset company". I don't think this term is appropriate as they hold at the very least intangible assets such as goodwill resulting from their userbase and the reputation among other things
pankkake: well then is there such a thing as a zero asset company?
mike_c: i possibly made up that term as a differentiator from mp's "nonzero asset corporation"
ozbot: Accounting for the nonzero asset corporation. The MPEx standard. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Pope
mike_c: ah, no, i didn't make it up
mike_c: "This accounting system is not intended for zero asset corporations"
mike_c: i better term might be "zero tangible assets company", but that is a mouthful.
Apocalyptic: yeah was thinking about that exact formulation
pankkake: virtual assets company
Apocalyptic: <pankkake> well then is there such a thing as a zero asset company? // how would you define it ?
mike_c: it's defined as 0 book value.
pankkake: yeah… lol
Apocalyptic: according to http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071005223326AAxjjiN it's related to a holding company, weird
diametric: pankkake: this thread is amazing. i just started reading back through the posts on it.
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
diametric: people are really convinced mircea_popescu is a scam artist
diametric: its hilarious
Apocalyptic: "Usually a holding company is an asset-less company" what, I thought a holding company holds share of other companies, which are classified as assets
pankkake: that's not really bothering me. I wouldn't pay the 30 BTC fee myself, nor do I desire to hold MPOE
pankkake: but the complete refusal to understand what things are…
pankkake: I have my opinion, and I'm going to say dumb shit till the end
pankkake: no matter how stupid it makes me look
pankkake: and those guys defend scams to the death
Apocalyptic: pankkake, because in their mind there is no way they could ever be wrong
pankkake: so you don't want on mpex anyway
pankkake: +them
pankkake: but being wrong is how you learn!
Apocalyptic: once you admit it
Apocalyptic: and realise you actually are wrong
pankkake: then you are not wrong
pankkake: that's how I'm always right
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 21 @ 0.02510002 = 0.5271 BTC [-] {4}
Duffer1: "Actually useful websites like crypto-trade or havelock as well as coloured coins will continue to gain traction as this shitty scheme dies out."
Duffer1: professional grade trolling right there
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 161 @ 0.001 = 0.161 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: diametric it's a convenient conviction.
mircea_popescu: Apocalyptic the "zero asset" thing is a term of art. a company that retains none of its income but distributes it all as dividends.
mircea_popescu: it has a better risk profile for the bitcoin investor than the alternative (if you review the early history of btc scams, 2011s, you'll see most corps turned scams once the "ceo" confronted the problem of "we have cashflow. what to do with that cash ?".
mircea_popescu: somehow "distribute it" never comes to mind. a problem fiat shares, for that matter. (buffett has some great comments on the topic)
Namworld: Comments? Is there readily availabe sources to read about that?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 262 @ 0.003889 = 1.0189 BTC [+]
ozbot: UPDATE 1-Penis pumps cost U.S. government millions, watchdog cries waste
dub: life imitates art
Duffer1: when uncle sam is paying there's always some asshole chargint them double
kakobrekla: ;;later tell mike_c yes.
gribble: The operation succeeded.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8036 @ 0.00084313 = 6.7754 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 500 @ 0.001 = 0.5 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: Namworld about what you mean ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 500 @ 0.001 = 0.5 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15100 @ 0.00084313 = 12.7313 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 2003 @ 0.001 = 2.003 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6382 @ 0.00084251 = 5.3769 BTC [-]
Namworld: Buffett's comments on the topic
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11800 @ 0.00084021 = 9.9145 BTC [-]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6418 @ 0.00084021 = 5.3925 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 36832 @ 0.001 = 36.832 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1570 @ 0.0000902 = 0.1416 BTC [-]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 40 @ 0.0499999 = 2 BTC [+] {2}
truffles: any challengers?
Namworld: challengers?
truffles: chess
Namworld: I still want to complete that chess tournament
Namworld: I did the first game with BingoBoingo
BingoBoingo: Namworld: Well, you v truffles
truffles: doesnt have to be in tourny
Namworld: Well there's a tournament
Namworld: Ok, if you play against 2 other players too in the tournament
truffles: boingo if u hit "go live" at chess.com it lets timer
BingoBoingo: lats timer?
mircea_popescu: Namworld well now i don't know, i read the stuff in a paper book a while ago. lettuce see
Namworld: ah, paper book. Too bad.
truffles: ya, like 5 min, 10 etc
Namworld: We can play live right here in this channel
Namworld: Just announce moves. Any board can do.
truffles: who goes 1st
Namworld: gribble can toss a coin
Namworld: Choose side
nubbins`: ;;flip
gribble: Error: "flip" is not a valid command.
nubbins`: i mean
nubbins`: ;;coin
truffles: heads
gribble: tails
Namworld: Choose sidenubbins doesn't count
truffles: heads
nubbins`: <--interloper
Namworld: ;;coin
gribble: tails
truffles: dam coin!
nubbins`: sometimes i suspect ;;coin is just ;;echo tails
Duffer1: coin hates you bro
BingoBoingo: ;;coin
gribble: heads
Namworld: You get to choose the side you want
truffles: srsly
nubbins`: so i sold a 0.5btc casascius coin for 6btc earlier today
Namworld: Erhm I mean I get to
Namworld: I take blacks
Namworld: You start your move
Duffer1: grats nubbs
Namworld: Make some nice gifs of the games
nubbins`: thanks, feels good. first one i've sold in a few months
nubbins`: first of that type, anyway
truffles: so uh i hope there isnt intermission in this
nubbins`: you know what they say about hope
nubbins`: ;;google you know what they say about hope
gribble: You know what they say about hope. It breeds eternal ... - Goodreads: <https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/409872-you-know-what-they-say-about-hope-it-breeds-eternal>; Quote by Sara Shepard: You know what they say about hope. It ...: <http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/315904-you-know-what-they-say-about-hope-it-breeds-eternal>; Pretty Little Liars - Wikiquote: (1 more message)
nubbins`: so close, just a word short
truffles: this pace is a bit..
truffles: slow
KRS1: wut
truffles: im sick n tired of these slow movers
Namworld: I'll try to speed up
Namworld: axb5?
dub: #bitcoin-assets-chessnerds?
truffles: u said a6?
nubbins`: jeez, don't be so demanding
truffles: so im on a4
nubbins`: glad i didn't play with you ;(
truffles: cant take my bishop yet?
truffles: oh i shouldve typed Ba4?
BingoBoingo: truff, yeah anything but a pawn needs further specification
Namworld: Yeh moved your bishop, Bb5. Do you even have a board in front of you?
nubbins`: heh.
truffles: so what is the ruling on that
nubbins`: the ruling is that you guys roll back a few moves and get your shit together
nubbins`: also
nubbins`: whoever is white should be numbering their moves
nubbins`: e.g.: 1. e4
Namworld: The moves will be accurate and the same for each
truffles: sigh
nubbins`: 2. Bb5, etc
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 10 @ 0.0248 = 0.248 BTC [-] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 215 @ 0.00265948 = 0.5718 BTC [-] {10}
nubbins`: makes it a lot less confusing
truffles: typing things by hand so
truffles: begin again?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 113 @ 0.00244437 = 0.2762 BTC [-] {5}
Namworld: Let's register on caissa and play live chess
truffles: no chess.com acct?
Namworld: No. Do they provide replays of games?
BingoBoingo: Namworld chess.com lets you download pgn's so yeah
truffles: Boingo provided pastebin of our last game so?
Namworld: BingoBoingo already played you?
truffles: ya 1-2
truffles: r u registering or ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 935 @ 0.001 = 0.935 BTC [+]
Namworld: I'm registering on chess.com
Namworld: How do we play against each other now?
truffles: invite by alias or email
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22800 @ 0.00084253 = 19.2097 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 1213 @ 0.001 = 1.213 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14982 @ 0.00084231 = 12.6195 BTC [-] {2}
truffles: Namworld still thinks this chess.com game will be valid :D
BingoBoingo: truffles well, it would be if you post some PGN
BingoBoingo: I believe as long as there is someting verifiable it should be good.
truffles: gonna try not to make noob mistake for future challengers
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5 @ 0.04999998 = 0.25 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10386 @ 0.00084101 = 8.7347 BTC [-] {2}
Apocalyptic: who's got a chess.com account ?
truffles: every1
Apocalyptic: i feel like playing chess tonight
truffles: wanna play timed ?
truffles: obv not this moment
Apocalyptic: yeah, let me remember my password first
truffles: either namworld is thinking or disconnected :(
Apocalyptic: timed != live ?
truffles: well u have to go to live chess to get the timers
Apocalyptic: what's your nick truffles ?
truffles: id like 10min, no increment
truffles: trufss
Apocalyptic: seems good
truffles: might as well since he's not here
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28200 @ 0.00084396 = 23.7997 BTC [+]
Apocalyptic: Albania really ?
truffles: u sent invite?
truffles: havent figured out this yet
dub: elbownia
Apocalyptic: hum I actually have some decent ratings there
truffles: how do u add time to it
Apocalyptic: go to live chess
truffles: ya i always get randoms!
Apocalyptic: you should see me on the friend tab
truffles: nope, u start it
ozbot: Play Chess Online - Free Chess Games at Chess.com
Apocalyptic: I could if you were there
truffles: refresh
truffles: dangit!
truffles: u missed that 1 :D
Apocalyptic: blunder :)
Namworld: I'm back truffles, sorry
truffles: 2 mins
decimation: Buffet is a famous dividend hater. Partially because of dividend tax treatment in the US, and partially because he believes in reinvesting in the company or buying back shares.
decimation: Most fiat companies use buybacks to pump up the stock price as ceo's sell their own shares
Apocalyptic: dat fork truffles
Apocalyptic: heh, good game
truffles: rematch soon
Apocalyptic: now what did I miss ?
Apocalyptic: <truffles> dangit!
Apocalyptic: <truffles> u missed that 1 :D
truffles: queen x knight
Apocalyptic: what move # ?
truffles: around 10
Apocalyptic: yeah... I was blind
Apocalyptic: anyway since I took the knight i just had to trade to ensure a clear win
truffles: sigh i forgot what i was doing with namworld now lol
Apocalyptic: is he any good ?
Apocalyptic: oh no I see
truffles: dunno yea
Apocalyptic: it was a bait truffles
truffles: shhh
Apocalyptic: if I took the night you would win my queen
Apocalyptic: after Re1 my queen would have been pinned
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 314 @ 0.00084396 = 0.265 BTC [+]
truffles: u think so?
Apocalyptic: i'm certain
Apocalyptic: see for yourself, but it's a typical tactic called pin
truffles: uh huh
Apocalyptic: my queen cannot move before it would expose my king to direct check from your rook
truffles: not visualizing that game
Apocalyptic: my only sane move is to take the rook, and I lose the queen at the next move
Apocalyptic: i'm talking about our game
truffles: im in a bad position already with namworld!
Apocalyptic: Namworld, what's your chess.com nick ?
truffles: click my name u can see the match
Apocalyptic: that's the thing, i can't
Apocalyptic: since it's not a live one
Apocalyptic: Namworld is taking ages...
truffles: standard
Apocalyptic: i recreated a game
ozbot: 1789546951.05324 | Next Diff in 1693 blocks | Estimated Change: 14.7893% in 10d 0h 14m 13s
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 12 @ 0.02499998 = 0.3 BTC [+] {2}
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 7370 @ 0.001 = 7.37 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.532 BTC [+]
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 531 @ 0.001 = 0.531 BTC [+]
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6617 @ 0.00084042 = 5.5611 BTC [-]
Namworld: I have conceded
Namworld: I've played awfully
Namworld: I shall be away for a while
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 41 @ 0.00370463 = 0.1519 BTC [-] {2}
decimation: Assuming btc continues to become more valuable at its current rate, what capital activity will return more future value than simply holding Bitcoin?
decimation: This seems to be the central question of bitcoin finance.
Apocalyptic: indeed decimation
Duffer1: gambling and drugs
decimation: well, mining and gambling in bitcoin come to mind
Apocalyptic: and so far i think it's holding bitcoin that is most profitable
decimation: as in, mining bitcoin
Duffer1: mining isn't profitable
decimation: Well, it depends on your assumptions
Duffer1: maybe if you owned stock in the manufacturer you'd do well
decimation: If btc surprises to the upside again, then mining might be retrospectively valuable
decimation: only if the manufacturer's stock were denominated in bitcoin
Duffer1: but not as valuable as just buying btc and holding for that same perior
Duffer1: period
decimation: that's likely the case, I agree.
nubbins`: having a brutal time installing ubuntu on this netbook
decimation: If you can purchase a miner in bitcoin though, that counts as a bitcoin investment
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 500 @ 0.001 = 0.5 BTC [+]
decimation: if you don't wish to buy with fiat for whatever reason
nubbins`: technically purchasing a miner with btc is a bitcoin divestment
nubbins`: not only technically but practically, too
decimation: it's really a bet that the difficulty won't go up as much as everyone hopes/fears in the future
decimation: a long bet
Duffer1: btc -> fiat -> vps mine shitaltcoin#1361235 -> dump on sucker on craptsy = more btc than you started with
decimation: well scams are always profitable
decimation: as long as you can find a greater fool
nubbins`: risk being that you're the greatest fool
decimation: indeed
nubbins`: someone's going to be left holding millions of dogecoin
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 200 @ 0.001 = 0.2 BTC [+]
decimation: buying altcoin is like investing in silver
decimation: anyone with common sense knows it's going to crash and burn
Duffer1: hehehe
BingoBoingo: Well yeah, digging new silver is relatively cheap
decimation: but you might convince a greater fool to buy your silver and make a profit
decimation: right that's my point
Duffer1: titanium ftw
Duffer1: ^ not real advice
nubbins`: cim/cif ftw
nubbins`: ^ real advice
mircea_popescu: speaking of the entire silver thing, what happened to pietilla, goat and usagi ?
mircea_popescu: the three silversketeers
BingoBoingo: First two still seem to be on the forum... who knows about Usagi anymore.
Duffer1: afaik goat's still working on his silver ltc project
nubbins`: goat changed his name on the forums
nubbins`: it's now uh, one sec
nubbins`: "[Default Trust] is Tyrannically Centralized! (goat)"
BingoBoingo: Dunno what people are up in arms about. Default Trust is just a user account on the forums that can be given negative trust
nubbins`: Duffer1: i've got some lovely certificates designed for those
Duffer1: oh cool i didn't know you were involved
nubbins`: nah, default trust is a list of people that, by default, all new users "trust"
nubbins`: i.e. their feedback appears in the "trusted feedback" section of a user's trust page
BingoBoingo: nubbins`: Well, they still implement the list by making it a user account and it can be given negative feeback just like any other.
nubbins`: ah, interesting
nubbins`: anyway, huge uproar about it all
nubbins`: pretty silly idea
mircea_popescu: nubbins` yeah, huge uproar in the sense that scammors are really butthurt there's some stuff they can't readily manipulate.
ozbot: Anyone still waiting for an Avalon Batch 3 refund?
nubbins`: heh, ;(
nubbins`: this image popped up in one of the old avalon threads, i lel'd heavily
mircea_popescu: the thick plot that keeps thickening
BingoBoingo: So all of Yifu's Avalon coins would get flagged dirty in his coinvalidator anyways
mircea_popescu: meanwhile, "Hi I am a 25 years old Italian boy. I entered the bitcoin about one year ago, so I am not so noob even if not expert."
nubbins`: i entered the bitcoin
nubbins`: it protested some, but it's a man's world
jborkl: I blew a 1 and a 0 as I enteredbit
mircea_popescu: entered the bitcoin
mircea_popescu: i think ima use this line
nubbins`: when did you enter the bitcoin?
mircea_popescu: "baby spread wide, i'ma enter your bitcoin"
mircea_popescu: your thebitcoin
nubbins`: he entered the bitcoin forcefully and without mercy
asciilifeform: anybody wonder how many people purchase miners just to launder coin?
Duffer1: interesting idea
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Well Good ole Trendon did that
asciilifeform: miner shits out the cleanest possible coin, so in principle if one's coin is 'dirty' enough, a miner might seem like a good investment.
nubbins`: 50 cents on the dollar if you're lucky
asciilifeform: a penny to the dollar is still better than the gasenwagen.
nubbins`: true
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform this is what "the community" didn't belive pirate's hash exchange was for.
BingoBoingo: nubbins`: What you do is start a pool and pay out better than the other pools
truffles: nubbins ure next
BingoBoingo: nubbins`: No need to own the hardware yourself.
decimation: what if mining guilds are doing this today?
asciilifeform: as i understand, not too many people are presently concerned with dirt
asciilifeform: other than the authors of the few most egregious heists
asciilifeform: does anyone give a damn about coin history in those famous bars where people trade suitcases of benjamins for btc?
ozbot: IcyHash Pool/Spork985 refusing to produce or explain multiple missing coins
mircea_popescu: "o you sent fiddy altcoins extra ? allow me to edit all the previous scamscreams!"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform all coins are and will remain equal. this is the concept known as fungibility.
Duffer1: wtf is a clockcoin?
mircea_popescu: Duffer1 yes.
decimation: is there a pool that publishes its accounting?
mircea_popescu: "It sounds like you need a few slaps in the face to get in touch with society."
asciilifeform: fungibility in this case is an ideal, not the actual reality on the ground (atoms of Au are fungible, btc aren't - at least, as presently implemented)
mircea_popescu: decimation p2pool used to i think ?
nubbins`: the bars i frequent are not the sort of places where one would bring a suitcase full of benjamins
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform bitcoins are more fungible than gold ever was, in practice.
nubbins`: maybe i'm frequenting the wrong bars ;(
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 485 @ 0.001 = 0.485 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: all those series on bars and so forth, they're kinda there to limit fungibility
asciilifeform: i always thought it was a practical measure, to let people skimp on assaying
mircea_popescu: this actually works as an argument. bitcoin needs no assaying, which makes it more fungible than something that does.
asciilifeform: this much is true
asciilifeform: but btc, unlike atoms of Au, has a public history, a fact that users ignore at their peril
decimation: if it's discovered that your wallet directly traded with a known thief's wallet - you might have problems one day
BingoBoingo: Well, if your gold was exposed to neutron radiation it may endanger your health one day
asciilifeform: 'the magic gold glowed blue in the water.'
mircea_popescu: explain this "you might have problems one day"
mircea_popescu: if you spend time in a smoky room "you might have problems one day"
asciilifeform: Der Ring des Nibelungen
asciilifeform: (re: magic gold)
ozbot: Wells Fargo, America's Largest Bank By Market Cap, Pushing To Offer Bitcoin Services | Zero Hedge
mircea_popescu: for that matter, discovering that your wallet directly traded with anyone is an exercise in impossibility.
asciilifeform: this concern is more in line with 'spend enough time in a smoky enough room, and you'll choke'
mircea_popescu: i tell you i don't see it.
mircea_popescu: run me through a scenario where you actually identify such a "direct trade"
asciilifeform: well, the trivial case:
nubbins`: feds sieze wallet of Derp Pirate Roy
nubbins`: last tx was 10k bitcoin to 1blahblah
asciilifeform: 1) 0day 2) clean out 'mtgox' or the like 3) same coin is deposited in exchange acct. with truename next day 4) gasenwagen
nubbins`: google search turns up whatever
mircea_popescu: so what if google search turns up whatever ? i can make google show up a shaved baboon when you google for nubbins
mircea_popescu: what of it ?
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 500 @ 0.001 = 0.5 BTC [+]
Duffer1: do it
asciilifeform: man with at least the brain of a slug would attempt to clean the booty somehow
nubbins`: that would be fun
nubbins`: anyway, merge my thought with alf's
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform let's go through this. mtgox wallet is emptied to address A.
mircea_popescu: address A sends back to mtgox for credit ? the same bitcoin ?
asciilifeform: well, let's have it be spent at 'coin bullion' (?) or the like.
nubbins`: let's buy trilema credits with it
asciilifeform: or buy a shipping container of whatever strange.
mircea_popescu: and so i have to judge this situation where you say coinbullion googled your name and used it to cover their theft
mircea_popescu: and coinbullion claims you're a haxxor ?
mircea_popescu: i'm throwing it out, it can't be resolved.
asciilifeform: traditional court might throw out the accusation. but courts are not the only mechanism for Having Problems.
asciilifeform: the fellow who got pwned might have his own ideas about justice
mircea_popescu: in which case we're back to your problems being widely abusable power, which is not a bitcoin thing.
mircea_popescu: you could get fucked by some guy who thinks he saw you fucking his wife.
mircea_popescu: or whatever.
asciilifeform: it is entirely true, and a good point, that the blockchain can be used by a skilled conniver to point blame at some random third party.
BingoBoingo: This sounds like the sort of case where BitBet could replace the court as a solution and to the laundering. Step one. Take positions on a Difficulty bet paying out to addresses with publicized different owners as well as addresses with unknown owners.
mircea_popescu: moreover, there's no good reason to presume this is not happening at any point, nor particularly easy or even possible to prove so.
mircea_popescu: bitcoin payments happen at order, without acceptance.
decimation: what if one were to use a deterministic wallet address derived from retina features for instance
asciilifeform: i vaguely recall the loot from various famous heists sitting quietly, never spent
asciilifeform: why would that be?
mircea_popescu: why not ?
mircea_popescu: most btc sits quietly, never spent.
BingoBoingo: decimation: That seems like a wallet I wouldn't want to use.
mircea_popescu: it's what it likes to do. fiat runs and bitcoin rests.
mircea_popescu: decimation even so, once an address is out it is public.
asciilifeform: decimation: the problem with biometric-anything is that you shout your 'password' every time you touch something (or, in this case, look in an eyehole)
mircea_popescu: well... for a pulse anyway
decimation: indeed, it would be idiotic. But it would be difficult to deny that it's not your wallet
mircea_popescu: but it would be stil lequally easy to deny that it's your transaction.
mircea_popescu: i can send you a bitcoin whether you wish to accept it or not, and whether you know or not
asciilifeform: it's yours and the first person who sets you up to look through an eyehole.
mircea_popescu: this was the nail that sunk the rota, practically.
mircea_popescu: as citizen-judges didn't quite grok the abyss.
asciilifeform: i recall some joker sent out a mountain of coin, a few satoshi at a time, to see where it gets consolidated
nubbins`: asciilifeform: that's still happening
nubbins`: one sec
ozbot: Bitcoin Address 1FFirnLctcZxVx5otnLNZ4dDGUkMBM4vNr
ozbot: Cease and Desist Letter to ASICSRUS
nubbins`: well, not sure of the motivation
nubbins`: but ~37btc dished out so far
nubbins`: in 0.001btc increments
asciilifeform: there's another answer to this
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4800 @ 0.00084042 = 4.034 BTC [-]
asciilifeform: (other than 'consolidation bait')
asciilifeform: data storage!
mircea_popescu: more from the "nsa killed my auntie" club
nubbins`: data storage?
asciilifeform: the addrs encode bits.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 332 @ 0.001 = 0.332 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: these may well be commands for a chumpnet.
benkay: why not push coins across mpex?
nubbins`: maybe. a few of the sends ended up on casascius rounds
asciilifeform: the addrs are probably plucked out of the blockchain at random.
asciilifeform: but with a useful pattern
nubbins`: nod, search for funded addresses
mircea_popescu: wouldn't the addrs actually be used as payload then ?
asciilifeform: say, lower 8 bits encode payload fragment.
mircea_popescu: why not use the whole thing ?
asciilifeform: because then the tx can be flagged as weird
asciilifeform: and, say, blockchain.info might decide to hide it
mircea_popescu: wait what ?!
mircea_popescu: how did you figure that ?
mircea_popescu: obviously you use a valid address
mircea_popescu: that's not much restriction.
asciilifeform: the tx needs to be algorithmically indistinguishable from a 'civilian' tx
asciilifeform: ideally the valid addr belongs to someone else
mircea_popescu: yes, which only means it has the checksum and starts with 1
asciilifeform: someone with a perfectly 'organic' usage pattern.
mircea_popescu: eh get out, new addresses get used all the time
mircea_popescu: there's no benefit in using some "organic" address. nor does this actually exist.
asciilifeform: sure. but the idea is, let's say AV firm goes to blockchain.info and says
asciilifeform: 'don't show these. this is a chumpnet artist'
asciilifeform: what's the best way to make them say 'goto hell' ?
mircea_popescu: it can say whatever the hell it wants. every time you make a payment a fraction is sent to a wholly new address
asciilifeform: answer: use civilian addrs.
mircea_popescu: completely indistinguishable from any address this guy'd make
asciilifeform: this is also a handy way to store bits in the chain that will never, under any conceivable scheme, get 'pruned.'
mircea_popescu: old txn past the checkpoint may get pruned eventually.
asciilifeform: dollars to doughnuts, the receiver for these broadcasts doesn't implement a full node
mircea_popescu: you know how checkpoints work ?
asciilifeform: it almost certainly fetches from blockchain.info or the like.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 206 @ 0.001 = 0.206 BTC [+] {2}
asciilifeform: yes, i know about checkpoint; hence the need to rebroadcast periodically.
asciilifeform: this is just one possible explanation, of course
asciilifeform: far more likely is the traditional hypothesis (bait), or a simple laundry.
nubbins`: silly laundry sending coins to other people's addresses
KRS1: .bait
asciilifeform: like the proverbial kid who sneaks into the school computer to change grades
asciilifeform: he damn well knows he needs to change many, not only his own
nubbins`: fair
decimation: heh. If someone were to steal all the btc from mtgox and distribute them to the last 1,000 addresses that mined at least one block would be considered a hero
asciilifeform: 'robin hood' is good fun so long as you're on the correct end of him, yes
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26700 @ 0.00084075 = 22.448 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: the moral here is that willy-nilly bitcoin will bring about deep and far reaching changes in human society, culture and mentality.
mircea_popescu: what property means and what remedies for theft are will change.
asciilifeform: 'the cold equations.'
mircea_popescu: much in the way what tax means and what taxation entails will change,
decimation: indeed
mircea_popescu: much in the way what law and the courts are will change and so on
decimation: how can a government promise to pay more bitcoin than exists for instance?
asciilifeform: seems almost certain that the days in which you needed to corner somebody in the flesh to collect a tax, will come back.
mircea_popescu: decimation that's a subset of "how can public companies be worth more than 20mn btc. they can."
mircea_popescu: just as long as the promise isn't to pay in specie and in one go, it still can stand.
decimation: but the lack of an implicit printing press will surely encourage the investors to be more skeptical
decimation: implicit promise to bailout I mean
mircea_popescu: even in practice, in the 1800s multiple governments owed more gold than was actually available in the world at the time
decimation: well that didn't work out well for germany
mircea_popescu: this didn't always and didn't necessarily result in a default
decimation: or the UK
mircea_popescu: tho it oft resulted in wars
asciilifeform: wouldn't that be more like owing 'MAX_INT' gold?
nubbins`: decimation: germany is doing just fine ;p
decimation: well, it also caused the US to abandon gold
asciilifeform: sort of how the average american owes MAX_INT dollars to somebody or other.
decimation: although it was mostly fiction anyway at that point
mircea_popescu: that wasn't in the 1800s
decimation: yeah I'm thinking WWI
mircea_popescu: in the 1800s the us was a bit player, fighting with mexico over the silver export to china
mircea_popescu: sort of like today's ukraine or what have you.
nubbins`: old women holding mirrors up to riot police
decimation: indeed, lincoln started the fiat craze to fund his religious war
mircea_popescu: o, you figure cause southerners weren't protestant enough ?
mircea_popescu: or not the proper type of dour ?
BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Southerners weren't poor enough
asciilifeform: decimation: there was precedent. plenty of u.s. localities had local crackpot fiats
decimation: yeah, banking back then was pretty much like trusting bitcointalk scammers with your money
asciilifeform: where banking today is a little more like trusting mtgox with it
ozbot: Newfoundland dollar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
nubbins`: fun fact, my grandmother was born a british citizen, never left her hometown, and died a canadian citizen
KRS1: When can I start trading pokemon and magic: the gathering on MtGox
decimation: ascii - solzhenitzyn said that they were meat wagons (in the end of The First Circle)
decimation: gasenwagon must come from East Germany or something
mircea_popescu: nubbins` that's nothing, plenty of old women around the balkans shed 5-6-7 nationalities
nubbins`: ha, too true
nubbins`: nationalities that still exist tho?
asciilifeform: gasenwagen - russian corruption of 'gaswagen' - in actuality, merely a truck powered by coal gas (wood stove bolted on the back, pumps out CO, which you can just barely run an engine on.)
asciilifeform: these trucks are often confused, by amateur historians, for the famous mobile gassers
mircea_popescu: nubbins` sort-of, not rly
mircea_popescu: austro hungarian, yugoslavian etc
nubbins`: ah, nod
mircea_popescu: as there's only 20 years between the two wars, and plenty of locales changed hands multiple times... it happens.
assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12000 @ 0.00084107 = 10.0928 BTC [+] {2}
decimation: anyway, to mp's original point about change, I think there is a fundamental truth about human nature. Humans require suffering to calibrate their joy
asciilifeform: i'm told there are a few in finland that still work. perhaps reptilia owns one
mircea_popescu: dude this guy... is he courting me personally ?
nubbins`: the referendum to join canada was passed with a scant 52% voting yes
mircea_popescu: first with the lincoln, now with the spankings...
decimation: no, what I mean is that the fiat regime allows the delusion of infinite wealth
decimation: humanity gets dumb, fat, lazy
mircea_popescu: decimation yeah well, i've been saying this to everyone's exhaustion for the past coupla years or w/e.
mircea_popescu: we just agree too much.
Duffer1: forced participation in welfare systems does not equal lethargy
mircea_popescu: Duffer1 but what's forced mean ?
Duffer1: unable to sustain without
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 364 @ 0.001 = 0.364 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: that's not forced, that's mere convenience.
Duffer1: it's survival
mircea_popescu: well that it may be, sure.
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 10000 @ 0.001 = 10 BTC [+]
mircea_popescu: problem with this approach is that if you follow it you'll end up filing rape charges against the only woman that'd have you
mircea_popescu: because clearly she forced you through your lack of other options.
decimation: for instance, the gasenwagen picture supplied by ascii. It's amazing to me that someone with the mechanical competence to assemble such a contraption would be unable to buy a few gallons of fuel
assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!
mircea_popescu: decimation there's no requirement that fuel availability and mechanical complexity relate in any particular proportion.
mircea_popescu: most populations were unable to acquire a few pounds of iron,
mircea_popescu: notwithstanding their astounding other accomplishments,
mircea_popescu: and so got trampled underfoot by those with better meteoric exposure.
mircea_popescu: hence the famous "the iron! oh my god the iron!"
assbot: [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 250 @ 0.001 = 0.25 BTC [+]
asciilifeform: 'tiger' tank is even more complex.
asciilifeform: what of it.
decimation: well, like bitcoin, the Werhmacht's fuel supply was theirs to lose
KRS1: .bait
KRS1: uh heh
nubbins`: haha
nubbins`: hm, trying to run ubuntu from usb, gets as far as "Stopping enable remaining boot-time encrypted block devices [OK]" and stops
nubbins`: tty1-6 offer command prompts
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