#trilema | 2018-04-22

mircea_popescu: let me say something rather... political here. so, an item caught my eye in one of the pastebins or w/e you put in : some guy saying "this bum cost me more than a gf". it entirely illuminated the problem to me : terry davis is JUST as much a perfect representative of the ustarded "brillian computer programmer" as http://trilema.com/2016/the-story-of-elliot-rodger-by-elliot-rodger-adnotated-part-one/ is the representative of t

mircea_popescu: he ustard neet-y teenager.

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: aha. he's the end stage of the life cycle.

mircea_popescu: terry davis is exactly http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-13#1798356 except turned up to 11.

a111: Logged on 2018-04-13 19:58 zx2c4: wondering - how might i achieve great wealth and donations for wireguard from you/trilema?

asciilifeform: helps to recall that the d00d is certifiably insane tho ( lived for yrs on a usg pension for insanity. as portrayed by TLP. wonder what happened to this -- they were abolished? i've nfi )

ckang: i think all terry needs to be happy is a room, bed, internet, diet shasta, beer and cigarettes

mircea_popescu: he has these things he'll do, he's decided aforehand, and nothing around matters ONE WHIT. now, will you pour bitcoin into his sand ? if you do ok, but to quote, http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-12#1796685

a111: Logged on 2018-04-12 02:38 ckang: Like he will owe something

mircea_popescu: ckang, no, actually, all he needs is an alternate reality where solipsism works.

ckang: when he lost that is when things became a lot worse for his mental state

mircea_popescu: just like everyone else on github. except more... purely so.

mircea_popescu: the other terries actually aquiesce to unprincipled exceptions, which makes them precisely just as fucking insane but entirely less remarkable.

ckang: did you catch the video of him talking about befriending a prostitute ?

mircea_popescu: ckang, no, it's when his entirely deranged mental state became a lot more difficult to "hide", in the sense usual usg.zek "hides" his being raped daily, from himself.

mircea_popescu: you can't go around pretending like he's ok. he's not ok, nor ever was, nor can ever be, but this is not so much a problem to whosoever is willing to apply formal tests only.

mircea_popescu: ckang, i did not.

ckang: oh no hes not okay by any means

ckang: but hes not talent-less

ckang: complex mix

ckang: let me find it, 1 minute

asciilifeform: d00d spends his days having 2way convos with his rng.

asciilifeform: ( or did, back when he had a comp... )

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, but i can imagine, you know, lenghty string of ustards trying to help, where their help was of the form "we'll expend x resources if you're willing to jump through y hoops" and he refusing and them going umm... why doesn't the form thing work!!1

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: they lament exactly so, and not specifically about this d00d, but erry single schizo ( incl prolly the one i saw last night )

mircea_popescu: that's the substance of "costs more than gf" -- resources, spent ; hoops, not jumped. "irrational" behaviour in the imperial contractual sense.

asciilifeform: this is the likely explanation for his transition to hobo stage -- prolly he finally stopped filling out the magic form etc

mircea_popescu: so amusingly enough, THEIR understanding of his mental issue is built entirely of his sanity. his problem is exactly the rest of what they identify. quite interesting marginal case in being so neatly split. usually there's some overlap.

mircea_popescu: but anyway, i'm starting to understand a lot of things about why the maga can never be, consider the gritted, unyielding, sheer determination of http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-20#1803769 ; and i've noticed my us-born slavegirls CAN NOT QUIT. even when hopeless, even when wasteful, their specific identifiable mark in whatever harem social games is they're the ones that can not fucking say uncle.

a111: Logged on 2018-04-20 17:44 mircea_popescu: finally coming out of the massive bender at t2, the dude WOULD STILL LIKE TO EAT. how would you eat if you were him ? would you give up, do something else with your time ? he doesn't give up. he's fucking dedicated.

mircea_popescu: now, 50, 100 years ago this was a great characteristic of that maybe-one-day-a-nation conglomeration in our colonies.

mircea_popescu: meanwhile it's become a fixation in the children ; now merge it with the church of self esteem and its holy youcandoanything, and the REASON http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-16#1800094 ie "smart kids" always being found with their pants down acting the "man alone" part and never learning anything from the experience is pretty fucking clear.

a111: Logged on 2018-04-16 16:19 mircea_popescu: man acting alone is stuck with these "oh, a conclave of idiots bent on self preservation and avoiding the lowly station their idiocy warrants them holds all the power, and i'll act as man alone confronted by governemnt".

mircea_popescu: larping, yes, but not merely for fun nor profit. larping as a life philosophy.

mircea_popescu: now go ahead and make it great again. HOW ? they lack the instruments with which they'd agree upon a great in the first place. collection of terries, give them coffee or not give them coffee, they'll move about like an algae bloom.

mircea_popescu: because it's not just terry. the entire population of github, from http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=dgerard to http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-06#1793426 and ALL shades in between, nothing, EXACTLY NOTHING but little terries running about.

a111: Logged on 2018-04-06 00:00 deedbot: http://trilema.com/2018/heres-what-polyamory-is-not/ << Trilema - Here's what "polyamory" is not :

mircea_popescu: now how the fuck can you build anything out of 100`000`000 elliots and 10`000`000 terries ? because that's the other fucking half of http://trilema.com/2014/pushing-the-soft-tender-flesh-of-a-friend-against-the-sharp-rotating-blades-of-the-immutable-machine/#selection-967.295-971.2 "how much does the devil have to pay you to love him" problem.

mircea_popescu: PAY WHO!!!???!?!?!

mircea_popescu: then they go all http://trilema.com/2016/alexacom-or-the-measurable-web-delusion/ but seriously... "uniques" ? holy shit they're not uniques, they're either little terries or little elliots. seriously, they READ YOU ? how the fuck could they ~possibly~ have read you past the psychogenic noise scrolldown going on in front of their eyes non-stop ? exactly http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-22#1804512 holy shit, "i have the attentio

a111: Logged on 2018-04-22 17:46 asciilifeform: d00d spends his days having 2way convos with his rng.

mircea_popescu: n of the lava lamp".

asciilifeform: iirc before davis went fullbore barmy, he was gainfully employed , in the old-fashioned sense, wrote embedded os thing for -- iirc -- 'ticketmaster' co

mircea_popescu: that's my recollection.

asciilifeform: whatever other mental cockroaches he could have suffered from in youth, it is all quite thoroughly masked nao by having gone properly batshit

mircea_popescu: and i'm pretty sure you're exactly right, he could be into fiat again if he started filling in the magic form again.

mircea_popescu: anyway, this is kinda what i was unknowingly reaching for, with the http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-20#1803880 : more data to extract the understanding out of what looked like a promising vein. but in the meanwhile sleep reorganized observation for me and now it's quite fucking plain.

a111: Logged on 2018-04-20 18:55 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, well, buy him a steak.

asciilifeform: d00d's on his unstoppable journey into the upper tundra.

ckang: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51iQOlOim4c

ckang: cant find the archive.org copy, it was called FirstMate.mp4

asciilifeform: prolly not long left.

ckang: but an interesting story, this was shortly after he got kicked out

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, not even worth the http://btcbase.org/log/2017-08-02#1692407 bullet.

a111: Logged on 2017-08-02 01:17 mircea_popescu: phf reminds me of fucktard murdock "oh, we were first apple store"

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: he never had anyffing at all they judged to be worth stealing.

mircea_popescu: before being terminated, ALSO gainfully employed (writing nsa crapolade for "docker" -- remember, if they're not dockers, they're just pants!)

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, or rather, knew how. see, murdock has "brand" or however you call the fool's gold they're only preoccupied with. they know how to steal that.

asciilifeform: a certified nutter is one of the 'safest' things to be, from this pov

mircea_popescu: whereas davis had less useful things -- they work.

asciilifeform: aha.

mircea_popescu: they don't look, they work. wtf can you do with something that works!

asciilifeform: worx, but no 'brand'.

mircea_popescu: well what's the use of that!

asciilifeform: sorta how asciilifeform is still alive. same dynamic.

asciilifeform: if there's no debian-style herd of ruminants attached, to your 'brand', then ~invisible to these folx.

asciilifeform: and can live for surprisingly long time.

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, see, this is one of the best arguments re http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-20#1803989 (though the correct word is punk, ie http://trilema.com/2012/big-rock-candy-mountain/#selection-227.1-233.34 ) : dood got fucked with the brand thing, stood himself up shakily, dusted self off... and dived right back into it!

a111: Logged on 2018-04-20 19:31 ckang: weev is an actual cuck btw, the true definition

mircea_popescu: STILL doesn't want to do things that work, but things that shine. well... why the fuck ? oobviously http://trilema.com/2017/yitzhaks-trilemma/

ckang: i think the last thing i heard weev say he was working on, was some python code to detect if a person in a photo is black or white

ckang: tensorflow i imagine

asciilifeform: such invention!111

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, there's a very interesting protection factor at work, too! if you do enough things that work, you can do plenty of things that in other people would create "brand" and be immune from it! consider the bit spyked recently dredged up, http://trilema.com/2009/niste-rigoare-pentru-mircea-badea/

ben_vulpes: ckang: i actually think that'd be a hilarious statistics project; just clustering on skeleton segment lengths would probably be enough to assplode the leftists heads

ckang: heh yea ive been trying to come up with a good use for tensorflow

ben_vulpes: "but the code of conduct says that the software cannot be allowed to say things about race etc!"

ben_vulpes: ckang: "from causes, not towards purposes"

trinque: > Terry needs like, clear evidence that there's a point to this fucking

trinque: what a life

ckang: lol you listening to his story?

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, i mean consider the lengthy list of shit. sent "academician" into retirement ? raped bank new arsehole ? raped govt ministry new arsehole, and as a community project no less ? raped... mit's "media lab" new arsehole ? exposed assets, exposed toolchains, i can do whatever the fuck i please and ~NOT~ be famous.

mircea_popescu: do one iota of things that work, get iota^? worth of things that brand free!

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: in uncle al terminology, 'they proclaimed it was Bad Luck and carried on'

mircea_popescu: and they will, too!

mircea_popescu: somehow at all junctures it was always "a better choice" in imperial logic to "blame bad luck", maybe execute a scapegoat or other, than identify the goldstein.

mircea_popescu: doesn't it make you stop and wonder ?

asciilifeform: it's the only ~effective tool in their box tho

mircea_popescu: but they could try a different ineffective one!

mircea_popescu: you know how "alt right" picked "soros" to be "the evil billionaire behind everything" ? do you suppose THAT is what prevents the "mainstream left" from identifying the evil billionaire behind their precious cuntlet losing the precious election and everything else ?

mircea_popescu: maybe i owe some thanks to these folk i don't even realise...

asciilifeform: as soon as the smarter folx in the enemy camp get the notion that there's somewhere to defect to -- game over

asciilifeform: and enemy -- knows this.

asciilifeform: ergo ~100% of effectual effort -- spent on squid ink.

trinque: I won't spend too much time on this, but it's interesting that he transitions from third person self-reference to first person when he gets angry.

trinque: herr davis, I mean.

asciilifeform: trinque: afaik commonplace among schizo sufferers

ckang: yea seems to depend if hes in a manic state or not

trinque: eh I don't buy the political terms for all this; that appears to be when his brain *is* working, instead of farting around in neurotic loops

mircea_popescu: trinque, let me tell you a story. so during napoleon era, for the first time "general army" was introduced, before that it was all profesisonal soldiery. huge humongous legions of draft dodgers, because really now, draft ? and napoleon standing for the "reasoning" "humanism" thingee of course introduced doctors to check whether medical claims were factual (most common amongst which, blindness).

mircea_popescu: now you tell me, how did they check ?

BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> you know how "alt right" picked "soros" to be "the evil billionaire behind everything" ? do you suppose THAT is what prevents the "mainstream left" from identifying the evil billionaire behind their precious cuntlet losing the precious election and everything else ? << "mainstream" left has as an anchor that "individual people can

BingoBoingo: 't"

mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo, but what individual ? what, it seems to you #trilema is individual ?

trinque: mircea_popescu: aimed musket at their heads?

mircea_popescu: no, but built special walkway with sudden low ceiling, saw if they ducked.

mircea_popescu: blind or no blind, french peasant isn't taking one to the head.

trinque: heh! nb

BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: The single typing fuckgoat they imagine is doing all the talking because... unfair. Shannonizer blindeness is internalized.

mircea_popescu: see, that's not "one weird trick". that's how EVERYTHING works. the basic 101 of http://trilema.com/2012/strategic-superiority-a-saga/#selection-233.62-233.144

mircea_popescu: when lawyer wants to test for truth, he offers guy obvious easy explanation, sees if guy takes it. if he does... he's looking for an out, isn't he!

mircea_popescu: and so yes, when he's angry his pretense fails to keep up.

BingoBoingo: To pantsuit all of #trilema has to read as vexual as vexual reads to us

mircea_popescu: you think ?

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: so, y'think d00d is malingering ?

asciilifeform: if malingering, wainot fill out them forms.

mircea_popescu: i can't call it ; but would be no worse strategy than what's the ru guy's name

asciilifeform: i can see malingerers for pension, or for draft-dodging, but what's his then for ?

mircea_popescu: yes, that's the nail. the ru guy did take what was it, some sort of something.

BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> you think ? << Probably. Nothing else explains Sweden's continued doubling down other than handicapping themselves because "dat signal's racist"

mircea_popescu: well, stupidity alwayus explains.

deedbot: http://qntra.net/2018/04/amazon-washington-post-sinks-to-new-lows-of-undisclosed-advertorial-content/ << Qntra - Amazon Washington Post Sinks To New Lows Of Undisclosed Advertorial Content

lobbes: <BingoBoingo> [...] "dat signal's racist" << ayup. Pantsuit trains "autoimmune response" to specific signals, and causes all kinds of broken thinking. I posit that this is the root cause of things such as >> http://btcbase.org/log/2014-08-06#784482

a111: Logged on 2014-08-06 00:42 mike_c: i have been in the newspaper multiple times, and i have been in trilema posts multiple times. one of these means more than the other, but I can only show my mother the newspaper clippings :)

lobbes: also: http://archive.is/AiwcQ#selection-1157.93-1157.211

mircea_popescu: i wonder what he's up to.

diana_coman: is there a tmsr patch/recipe for feeding /dev/random from fgs? my search of logs yielded only http://btcbase.org/log/2018-02-09#1783118

a111: Logged on 2018-02-09 20:57 mircea_popescu: drivers/char/random.c is what needs changing. wipe the calls to "add_disk_randomness" and bullshit, replace with your fg feeder.

mircea_popescu: nothing published afaik.

mod6: I was going through my mom's stuff yesterday, she kept all kinds of trilema clippings.

mod6: Hehe, she printed them off, three-hole punched 'em, and put em in a binder, no less.

asciilifeform: diana_coman: out of curiosity, why do you want to put your fg's through linus's whitener ?

asciilifeform never implemented a fgtronic /dev/random replacement , quite deliberately, and iirc the reasons are in the log

asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-06-13#1669565 << 1 thread

a111: Logged on 2017-06-13 16:11 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: iirc we had a thread even here where somebody whined that FG doesn't work as a 'totem' where you 'plug in and forget and it just becomes your /dev/random' and that it has to be actively ~used~

diana_coman: asciilifeform, in short: bridge gap until eulora's server migrates to eucrypt; not a solution to anything, nor a desired anything

asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2017-02-24#1617414 << iirc orig thread

a111: Logged on 2017-02-24 02:05 asciilifeform: which is why /dev/random was a terrifyingly bad idea from day 1./

asciilifeform: diana_coman: fair'nuff

asciilifeform: diana_coman: iirc danielpbarron had a roughly working hack that did what you asked for

asciilifeform brb, eating

mircea_popescu: mod6, really ?!

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, in practical terms, how do you want s.mg to use fgs until rewritten ?

mircea_popescu: danielpbarron, got ?

deedbot: http://trilema.com/2018/the-top-brass/ << Trilema - The Top Brass

danielpbarron: diana_coman, a package called sys-apps/rng-tools has a thing called 'rngd'

mod6: mircea_popescu: Yeah! Kinda neat. Bunch of Qntra articles too.

mod6: asciilifeform mircea_popescu diana_coman et. al. re: rngd : http://logs.bvulpes.com/pizarro?d=2018-4-13#332963 << Where I discover the author of this thing

mimisbrunnr: Logged on 2018-04-13 01:48 mod6: Looks like maybe we need to do the latter -- write our own. Did anyone notice that Jeff Garzik is one of the authors of this thing?

mircea_popescu: heh

mod6: http://logs.bvulpes.com/pizarro?d=2018-4-13#333199 << this too.

mimisbrunnr: Logged on 2018-04-13 12:46 mod6: you know what else in interesting, when i breezed super fast through the code last night (I need to review it more), i noticed that this thing has it's own copy of "ent" embedded inside.

danielpbarron: yeah it's way slower than getting the random from FG directly

mod6: The main thing that I wanted to do was come up with a TMSR~ blessed methodology for Pizarro clients to use to fruitfully use their in-chassis FG.

mod6: Then post it somewhere for all to see. And if they want to make their own / can make their own, then that's fine. But we should work towards this.

mircea_popescu: mod6, indeed.

asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-22#1804633 << sadly asciilifeform is not so familiar with the existing proggy, to answer this properly

a111: Logged on 2018-04-22 21:29 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, in practical terms, how do you want s.mg to use fgs until rewritten ?

mircea_popescu: yeah. anyway, i'm thinking the best approach would actually be a kernel patch to destroy the extant random/urandom bs and replace it with fg

mircea_popescu: ideally simply have it exposed as /dev/random

asciilifeform: right

asciilifeform: would have to properly handle all types of attachment for the fg tho ( usb serial, genuine serial, etc )

asciilifeform: and so would be sensitive to device init order, which imho is icky

asciilifeform: asciilifeform often wonders if we're doomed to make a pci fg

asciilifeform: ( why not made originally ? pci adds 100x the complexity; ugly; expensive )

asciilifeform: the pc arch just plain old suxxxx. every method of dealing with this, has own tradeoff.

asciilifeform will admit, to having sat down to write a kernel mod for fg no fewer than 3 times, and barfed each time

asciilifeform: https://archive.li/xhVBU << in related vintage entomology .

asciilifeform: ( for the sake of record : a non-retarded arch would do random like-so : ~as a cpu instruction~ that reads from N ~asynchronous~ ports , where N is odd, debias, and xor )

asciilifeform: speaking of fg, ave1 really oughta have gotten his fg crate by nao

asciilifeform: ave1 didja get it ?

asciilifeform: the 2nd attempt at the crate went out on the 11th

asciilifeform: https://elixir.bootlin.com/linux/latest/source/drivers/char/random.c << the 'traditional' /dev/random. ( get yer barf bag ready! )

asciilifeform: pointerolade, spinlock, sha1, you name it , it's got it...

asciilifeform: and 2200+ln

asciilifeform: ( not including #include'd rubbish, of which there is a mountain, as is typical )

mircea_popescu: why ? if it doesn't get juice it just blocks

mircea_popescu: you're more than welcome to fix it.

asciilifeform: which why?

mircea_popescu: why handle anything.

asciilifeform: because afaik shitkernel offers no deterministic way to fix

asciilifeform: ( if i'm wrong about this, folx, plox to write in )

mircea_popescu: doesn't have to. /dev/random is blocking. all it needs to do is block if it has no fg.

asciilifeform: right but how does it know where is an fg.

mircea_popescu: it does not care.

asciilifeform: from where does it read ?

mircea_popescu: from wherever we make the standard. usb i guess ?

asciilifeform: right but where.

mircea_popescu: what do you mean, where.

asciilifeform: could implement module the obvious way : takes N args, each of which must at load time be a valid /dev/ttyxxxx

mircea_popescu: yes.

asciilifeform: but this is incompatible with, say, a trinque-style kernel, that dun support loadable modules at all

mircea_popescu: well if the kernel can't be patched then a patch won't help.

asciilifeform: ( i have the rockchips currently with these )

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the current set of kernel modules, largely work in either 'module' or 'built-in' mode, depending on how compiled

mircea_popescu: but the idea isn't for ~our~ kernels. the idea is to have an infection vector, that permafucks a linus-tso kernel into no longer working like a piece orf shit.

asciilifeform: the scheme described above, would work only as a loadable mod.

asciilifeform: plox to elaborate?

mircea_popescu: i don't believe in this philosophy of "universal support". "break everything until it fully conforms to tmsr expectation" is entirely sufficient.

asciilifeform: recall, linus's kernel has no notion of random, it implements '/dev/random' as yet another sort of faux device, via module

asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: this sounds great and wholesome but still gotta decide exactly how to break and where.

mircea_popescu: indeed. which is why i was encouraging mod6 to look into it.

mircea_popescu: but let's delve into detail here :

asciilifeform: i can describe some known dead ends. for instance, you definitely do not want to marry the thing to the pl2303. because 1) you have no way of knowing that every pl2303 on usb is an fg 2) not every fg user got a pl2303 , they get whatever cheapest chinese cable is at any given moment 3) for all i know, pl2303 will not be gettable next month, next yr etc

mircea_popescu: so, tmsr-kernel, such as for instance the very tight musl stuff, or what cuntoo evnetually will become, is out of scope for this discussion. of course it should have native fg handling, and im sure it will.

asciilifeform: my whole point was that there can be no such thing as 'native fg handling' on pc. there's always a piece of shit in the way, e.g. usb.

mircea_popescu: neverthless, inca-kernel, be it "debian" or whatever it is, needs a way to be fucked such that it stops exposing any /dev/random AT ALL for as long as it is not exposing a fg random.

asciilifeform: aaa

asciilifeform: this is pretty easy.

mircea_popescu: that's all that's contemplated here, all we really want from the rest of the shitpile is a very clear knob, which, when turned, makes everything stop working that doesn't work like we expect it to work.

mircea_popescu: that's it and that's all.

mircea_popescu: and let them pick the pieces.

asciilifeform: trivially, the 'random.c' item linked earlier, simply cut it.

mircea_popescu: so you can waltz into dc installed "linux", patch it, and it either has /dev/random perma-blocked or else fg-streaming.

asciilifeform: ( observe, linus hasn't really got a kernel, just a tall pile of items like the one linked )

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, well, ideally patch random.c into a fg streamer.

mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, quite.

asciilifeform: incidentally , knob won't 'break errything that isn't proper', troo champions of idiocy like gpg , will chug along without a working /dev/random ( iirc -- silently )

mircea_popescu: yawell.

asciilifeform puts the postgres docs down, drained for nao, goes back to bed, apparently did in fact pick up some sort of slow-burning infectious nasty on the return plane

mod6: ugh. get some rest, Sir

trinque: perhaps there's a yet more immediate route. /dev manager (eudev, w/e) is simply told to symlink /dev/random to the FG device.

mircea_popescu: trinque, that does at least half the job -- will get some actual entropy in there, even if it doesn't prevent the dilution with cvasi-random crap

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